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Consumer Products => Avast Free Antivirus / Premium Security (legacy Pro Antivirus, Internet Security, Premier) => Topic started by: bpan on November 02, 2012, 02:57:26 AM

Title: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: bpan on November 02, 2012, 02:57:26 AM
Had this pop up during my nightly definitions update. 

Seriously?
WTF?

IS THIS A LEGITIMATE SURVEY BY AVAST?

I'm starting to think that I've been HACKED!

(Avast 7.0.1466) Free - webrep (disabled due to constant problems...)

Is Avast seriously polling it's USA users to find out how they'll
vote in the pending election?

I'm thinking now that this is wholly inappropriate!

I think an answer from AVAST very soon would be VERY appropriate!

Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: bpan on November 02, 2012, 05:15:04 AM
The fact that no-one from AVAST and no-one else has responded to my post,
makes me even more curious as to WHO prompted this query.

I'm downright PISSED OFF THAT THIS HAPPENED AT ALL!

YOU SHOULD BE TOO!

If you live in the United States of America - YOUR VOTE

IS YOUR VOTE.

I hope you're vote is not being circumvented by someone else,
nor that you're being influenced by someone else to vote,
other than how you wish to vote.




Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: Asyn on November 02, 2012, 07:10:49 AM
Had this pop up during my nightly definitions update. 

Please post a screenshot.
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: milosK on November 02, 2012, 08:24:00 AM
The link to the survey is here: http://www.avast.com/en-us/lp-survey-us-election
and it is nothing more than what is says:
"Some fun for the weekend... can the AVAST user community predict the Presidential Election?"

And to be clear, we don't track any personal data - the survey and responses are completely anonymous.
Sorry for not responding sooner.  With the time difference I only got your post few minutes ago.
 
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: AuraofVengeance on November 02, 2012, 01:16:04 PM
I also received this survey a few minutes ago. The survey plus the constant nagging about installing avast on android with no clear way of disabling these ads has pushed me to drop avast as my main AV support.
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: 4me2play on November 02, 2012, 02:31:50 PM
The survey surprised me... But, I have no problem answering the questions. http://forum.avast.com/Smileys/default/shocked.gif

I would like to see the results, though. Seems like Avast could show the results of the voting right after someone votes. Don't show it to others, though, only the voters.http://forum.avast.com/Smileys/default/smiley.gif
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: MikeAndNick on November 02, 2012, 02:34:18 PM
You are a little too picky and your survey answers do not have the one I would select.  I am glad Avast supplies a very good "Free" antivirus and I am glad they are interested in my country.  You did not have to answer the survey.  You can turn off the pop-ups.  Thank you Avast for Doing the Presidential Election Survey, where can I find the results?
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: popeye128 on November 02, 2012, 05:02:16 PM
I have no problem with it, glad to say who I want to win. Will be interesting to see if the results hold true.
Also would like to know if there is someplace to view the tally.
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: flowerchild on November 02, 2012, 06:23:55 PM
It's a survey  - you do not have to respond.  Are you ashamed of who you're voting for?  Or are you one who just searches for things to gripe about?

They will post results on Monday it said.
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: milosK on November 02, 2012, 07:46:29 PM
Yes, it will be published on Monday.  Right now there is about 50 000 votes submitted and the score is 49%vs42% Obama/Romney.
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: marc-d-l on November 02, 2012, 08:30:31 PM
I'm voting for Alfred E. Newman     (mad) ;D
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: Para-Noid on November 02, 2012, 09:12:31 PM
It's just one small pop-up. No reason to get all bent out of shape. If this survey is the worst thing that happened to you today great.
You have the option to "vote" or not to vote. Keep it all in perspective. The survey poses no security risk. Therefore...no harm, no foul.
What gets me is someone started this ridiculous poll/thread. What's worse is I posted in this thread.  ::)

I'm thinking about voting for Michael Rodent aka Mickey Mouse.   ;D
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: ManyQs on November 02, 2012, 11:17:57 PM
What concerns me is that I have already become a tad concerned with the path I sense this company has started down, and this just deepens my sense of something not good.  This is an Internet security related product and political surveys of any sort, for any country, are about as related to their business as my auto manufacturer asking me the same questions about political matters.

I then must consider that my IP address is in a land far from the United States.  What gives with that?  Survey is going out to all those using English in their product?

Anyway, what in the world is going on?  My Internet security company asking me about some election in the United States! 

Well folks, you are going to start down THAT path?  Fine!!  Now, in the interest of fairness we want to see surveys for every election (and some others) for all nations on this planet.  It's only fair, right? 

You guys in the Chinese market, yet?  Don't you want my views on the politics there?  They're just a stone's throw away from me. 

Maybe that's who asked you to do that United States survey -- the Chinese?

Oh yes, and if you are going to have a survey as part of your product, you best open up a sub-forum for the discussion of the topic of the survey.  That's also "only fair".

On the other hand, why not stick to your own business -- Internet security.  Please.  I really don't want to have to shop around for a new product.
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: polonus on November 02, 2012, 11:40:43 PM
Hi ManyQs,

You have to present this survey in the right context,.
The survey comes from SurveyMonkey and avast and the setting is social networking like on facebook and through twitter.
As the Internet is functioning to-day (personally I am not partaking in social networking using facebook or twitter,
but that is my good right) there is the real world and the semi-official world of social networking.

In that setting I think such a survey could be  acceptable.

It would be quite another thing that we started to tweet etc. about security issues.
But then also  I can imagine that many of the younger that were brought up with a laxer view on the presence of commercialism and privacy intrusion,
would not share my point of view.
The world is rapidly changing in this way and the old paradigma's are shifting slowly.
 It may not have come to your part of the world yet and the general more formal view of your society on these issues.

The Chinese I think form a bad example because they have by nature a great interest in modern trends and are seemingly adhering to these quickly.
Avast and SurveyMonkey sign of the times.
I have a beautiful extension in my Google Chrome named Dynamite and as I see something on a page that is not to my liking,
I dynamite it and it is gone for the time until the page is reloaded.
Well I keep voting for avast  ;D

polonus
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: DavidR on November 02, 2012, 11:55:25 PM
@ ManyQs
Well I certainly haven't seen it so it isn't going out to those using English in their product, don't know why you got it then. Don't know if as polonus suggests it might have something to do with social networking, e.g. the avastUI, Settings, Community, Show social networking features option or not (I don't have that checked).

As they steer clear of Religion and Politics two of the most divisive topics.

I might live in England, but whoever is the US President will have an impact one way or another on many non-US citizens.

I would have though with your signature and forum that you actually might have wanted to know more.
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: ManyQs on November 02, 2012, 11:56:26 PM
Thank you for your views, polonus, and everything you state might be all very true and all that, but my first impression when I see that thing -- and it didn't state in that little box it wasn't an Avast survey -- my first impression is there is money involved in some way.  That somebody is paying Avast to do that.  I then take the thought to whether the company is really in need of cash.  Then, if I have time, I start to wonder why they need money.  In some cases I come here.

I didn't come here about the poor English in that Facebook thingy popup, but as it didn't show again I figured somebody already had informed somebody here to fix the English.  That was what -- about three or four weeks ago?

Now it's politics.

Let's see,  if I buy a product from this company do I still get these little intrusions?  Maybe I'll buy one of the products just to be nice and help them.  I mean, there's a money factor in this, right?  They need money, maybe we should help a bit.  I don't mind paying for a couple of years after using the product with the price tag of 0.  If I'm going to go and be nice to some company I can't think of a better place to do it -- the people that run my security for me.  Maybe they can get back to their own work and not have to go getting money from those monkey folks you mentioned.

EDIT:  Because still learning to type.  Sorry.
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: ManyQs on November 03, 2012, 12:03:15 AM
DavidR, the last place I expected to be asked about my political views was embedded in a popup related to my security product.  Where I choose to discuss politics has not one thing to do with this.  This has to do with relevancy.  And why they need money.  Well, the last is what worries me more than the first.

BUT, as I wrote earlier, if this company wants to start soliciting my views (or let others do so through them) on political things, then it's time to open up a Lounge sub-forum.  Didn't we have one once?  Along with our little flags?
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: jadinolf on November 03, 2012, 12:24:19 AM
It's just one small pop-up. No reason to get all bent out of shape. If this survey is the worst thing that happened to you today great.
You have the option to "vote" or not to vote. Keep it all in perspective. The survey poses no security risk. Therefore...no harm, no foul.
What gets me is someone started this ridiculous poll/thread. What's worse is I posted in this thread.  ::)

I'm thinking about voting for Michael Rodent aka Mickey Mouse.   ;D

And I voted for Wendell Willkie.
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: ManyQs on November 03, 2012, 12:42:01 AM
Wendell Willkie's book about his travels after the election, when he was sent around the world by the US government, is quite good.




.
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: polonus on November 03, 2012, 12:44:45 AM
Hi ManyQs,

It is always a good thing to discuss such issues. Here in my part of the world and that is in the Netherlands I see that we have to get accustomed to new views.
It is a global influence setting in..
We see a different consumer approach of privacy issues and the role of consumerism and commercialization. Mozilla firefox spokesmen just stated that 2013 will be the year of the privacy issues. I do not know how the Nihon situation is and the attitude of the general public.
Services on the Internet come can still be free by selling user profile data and ad revenues. I am afraid that Richard Stallman's future predicyions of where the Internet was going were not mucg of the mark. Gradually people were made to accept these issues - television ads with a little bit of program in between. If not for adblocking a lithany of ads popping up all over the screen. Youngsters have a much greater toleration level. Haven't you noticed on a bus that a lot of people during the night keep on talking because they fear silence. I think the mobile age will only further these discrepancies. I also agree that a discussion of these issues could be healthy and I also think it would be wise if commerce would listen to the minorities of consumers,

polonus
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: ManyQs on November 03, 2012, 12:52:14 AM
I think it would be really good if we could discuss Net related topics on this site, like privacy issues.  Or that UN meeting coming up which they have gone to some length to assure us isn't a step down the road to regulating the Net out of an office at the UN.

I'm a longstanding member of the ISOC and keep up on these matters and I think this website would be an excellent place for such discussions.  But ...
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: Chris Thomas on November 03, 2012, 01:23:20 AM
Honestly, voting for Romney or Obama is the business of the citizens of the United States of America.

This poll can be done by anyone in this world, so its probably biased. Most people in the world would never have heard about 'Romney' because he is just a governor. Everyone knows who is Obama because he is the President and has traveled around the world as the President even to countries like Egypt, even though nothing deeper than that.
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: polonus on November 03, 2012, 04:01:31 PM
@ManyQs,

The website htxp://www.isoc.com is given as clean, but users with firefox and Google Chrome browsers won't see it, because it is blacklisted by Google Safebrowsing as with suspicious activity -> https://www.google.com/safebrowsing/diagnostic?site=www.isoc.com
The site's WP software needs updating. But scanner give this site as clean:
http://chrome.quttera.com/chrome_detailed_report/www.isoc.com
http://urlquery.net/report.php?id=83118
http://sitecheck.sucuri.net/results/www.isoc.com
Can you comment?

polonus
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: jadinolf on November 03, 2012, 04:16:30 PM
Wendell Willkie's book about his travels after the election, when he was sent around the world by the US government, is quite good.




.

Yep

I remember sitting in the rumble seat of my dad's car shouting we want Willkie. The people wanted Roosevelt. ;D
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: polonus on November 03, 2012, 06:03:00 PM
Hi manyQs,

Also the website you give: htxp://www.speakezforums.com/  is flagged by Bitdefenders TrafficLight as infected.
This given safe here: http://www.computer-support.nl/Systeemtaken/taakinfo/113422/forum_fn.js/

polonus
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: ManyQs on November 03, 2012, 08:44:19 PM
Sorry, polonus, that was careless of me.  I was referring to the Internet Society here https://www.internetsociety.org/.

As for SpeakEz being flagged by Bitdefender TrafficLite, not sure about that at this writing.  What sort of "infection" did the tool indicate?  If I may ask that here.  Looks like I need to install some software on my computer to be able to check myself and I'm afraid I don't have time just at the moment.  I only woke up because of an earthquake we just had.  Not a bad one, by the way.

Still, thank you for the heads-up and I'll get to checking on that after I get a bit more sleep.
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: polonus on November 03, 2012, 11:33:57 PM
Hi ManyQs,

The BitdefenderTrafficLight flag for that forum site may be because of the IP it is on that is being shared by sites with unknown html malware on,
like for instance htxp://roothacks.net/Hacks/Test/D3DX9_41.dll a domain also from 208.100.54.31. Malware now closed or dead.
GET /PGToi8gq/^^index.html HTTP/1.0 attacks,

polonus
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: Alsamont on November 04, 2012, 03:53:38 AM
Woah there, pardners! What's with the paranoia? Listen -- if you subscribe to Avast! (or install their products for free), they have every right to ask for your opinion on a public issue; you're always free to decline.  This one happens to be a poll of users' political preference; to wit, who's gonna win the 2012 presidential election? To any numbskull out in internet land who believes their vote is sacrosanct, I have a surprise for you -- nobody freakin' cares what you think or for whom you vote other than for its value as poling data! If your vote is such a big deal, why would you not stand up and express pride in the candidate for whom you support?  And one other thing, boys and girls, Uncle Alsamont has some really big scary news for you -- not only ain't Sandy Claws real, neither is your vote. The U.S. is a democratic republic and the president is elected by the electoral college, not the common vote -- hmmm er uh -- that would be YOUR vote!
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: norel on November 04, 2012, 05:57:52 AM
I have no problem telling anyone my political views, but I really don't feel Alwil has any business quering my intentions. I have popups disabled so I didn't see it, but now that I'm hearing about it I find it strange and a little suspicious. This may be the last straw for me with Avast.
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: ManyQs on November 04, 2012, 11:26:10 AM
I suppose, Alsamont, your gas company then has the right to ask your views on what to feed the pet elephant, the electric company has the right to ask what roofing seems best for the grass hut ... oh yeah, the newspaper folks can come around to your house and ...

Give me a break there, "pardner".  You really think we who wonder about a Net security company renting out their information popup to some polling company is a sign of paranoia?  Let's see now, the program update popup hasn't worked for the last two programs they put out.  Couldn't be they have their minds elsewhere, no?  Of course not.  Little Miss Avast has been getting the virus definition announcement all screwed up for a fair bit now and that was supposed to be fixed after the 1466 version.  Nothing to do with their minds being elsewhere, right? 

Those and other glitches are all signs of our paranoia, right, "pardner"!?   
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: mancillaj on November 04, 2012, 11:41:02 PM
I have no problem with a little fun asking about who we voted for for president. If I felt it was no ones business, I wouldn't have to fill out the survey. I feel it is just like when the people stand outside the polling place and ask who you voted for. You don't have to answer then and you don't have to answer here.
Isn't it great to be in a country that we can make those decisions on our own.
I too wish I could have see the results, I do look forward to them though.

This little survey at the beginning of the post makes no sense. They are all negative responses.

 Yes - AVAST has no business querying my potential vote!
 Yes - my vote is private!
 Don't know - if I care?
 Not sure - if I care?
 AVAST has no business querying my vote!
 AVAST has overstepped their bounds.  NONE OF THEIR BUSINESS!
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: Davisgloff on November 05, 2012, 03:33:32 PM
very simple to ignore.. for goodness sake.. just relax.
There's nothing mandatory about it, nor should there be.
I can't find the results.. just curious..
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: erbrecht on November 05, 2012, 04:36:47 PM
I suppose, Alsamont, your gas company then has the right to ask your views on what to feed the pet elephant, the electric company has the right to ask what roofing seems best for the grass hut ... oh yeah, the newspaper folks can come around to your house and ...   

Yes, frankly, they do have the right to ask any of those questions.  They can't require that you answer them in order to continue service, but they can certainly ask.

And they don't have to ask about every election in every country "just to be fair."  It's totally their prerogative to put up an opt-in survey about one specific election in one specific country.  You are blowing this way out of proportion.

mancillaj, I also noticed that all the answers were negative.  Strange poll, and [sarcasm]I'm offended that someone asked me those questions.  It's no one's business but mine how I felt about that survey.[/sarcasm]

I'm also looking for the results, but it's early in the day yet, at least where I am.
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: norel on November 05, 2012, 06:20:34 PM
The issue isn't whether or not they have the right, they have the right to do whatever they want. I guess I just don't understand why Alwil would spend their time dreaming up new ways to nag end users when they could be concentrating on improving their product. I've been losing confidence in Avast for awhile, and now this is it, I'm out. Free or not, Avast just isn't worth it anymore.
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: lukor on November 05, 2012, 09:05:37 PM
Hi norel, I write just to assure you that no developer time has been allotted to this survey, as far as I know.  We are still working on new versions and hunting bugs, don't worry. Guys from other teams might wonder if you'll be amused by this kind of survey or perhaps what kind of activities to bring to facebook or similar places, but these are not the same people.


Bye,
Lukas.
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: ManyQs on November 06, 2012, 01:42:08 AM
Thank you, erbrecht, for highlighting a key point of my post -- relevancy.

The United States presidential election has what to do with Internet security?  Please enlighten me. 

Just like the pet elephant and the gas company.  Especially like the electric lights and a grass hut.

What I see is a company renting out a popup which we normally pay attention to because some clever ad fella/gal realized our attention is focused on that popup at least once a day.  Quite clever that fella or gal.  But that's Google style BE and it is one more indication that this company is growing branches which are weird.

Sure, they have a right to rent out that space to another company and make money.  But we, as customers, have a right to complain and/or question that.  Don't we?

Yep, market googlization. 

Remember the lesson of the rip in the sheet?  Ask your self what might be next? If you are brave enough.
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: Asyn on November 06, 2012, 07:14:46 AM
I'm also looking for the results, but it's early in the day yet, at least where I am.

-> http://blog.avast.com/2012/11/05/100000_voter_survey__romney_ahead_but_more_believe_that_obama_will_win/
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: -midnight on November 08, 2012, 01:10:47 AM
Just popped up along with my virus definitions update.  I'm sure most Avast users also got this.  Whoops!  Sorry!  Didn't pay any attention to the post above mine until I after I posted.  :-[   Since my post shows exactly what Asyn's does will delete mine.

 
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: DBone on November 08, 2012, 01:40:41 AM
If avast! keeps up this kind of stuff, sooner or later, it will quarantine itself as a PUP/Adware.
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: Coolmario88 on November 08, 2012, 01:59:21 AM
So wait some people are getting mad cause avast had a little thing asking if they would vote in a survey thing? So you are mad because you clicked the survey thing? You could have just clicked the "x" and ignored it people. :-\
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: DBone on November 08, 2012, 02:19:43 AM
It's just the point, not the effort required to bypass it. Give a rat a cookie, he's going to want a glass of milk.
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: Kilia on November 08, 2012, 07:39:51 AM
As my late hubby would say:
Quote
"Ain't no deal guys....simmer down."
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: georgermct on November 08, 2012, 01:33:57 PM
(brought here from another forum)
Avast is totally a joke and they are shoving it right in every one's face.
They don't want to be taken seriously (obviously).
Avast is no longer is on my computer ever since it let a virus get through.
I now gladly give my money to a top antivirus company, that works and is SERIOUS about protecting my computer.
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: Kilia on November 08, 2012, 04:17:45 PM
(snip)
I now gladly give my money to a top antivirus company, that works and is SERIOUS about protecting my computer.
...and what antivirus company would that be now?
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: georgermct on November 08, 2012, 04:31:32 PM
(snip)
I now gladly give my money to a top antivirus company, that works and is SERIOUS about protecting my computer.
...and what antivirus company would that be now?

Well I didn't want to mention names but since you asked, Kaspersky.
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: ManyQs on November 08, 2012, 04:50:03 PM
Could someone identify for me/us what the entity called SurveyMonkey is and what part they had in this?  Thank you.

In case you missed it, SurveyMonkey was noted in an earlier post by one of our members.  I meant to ask who they are, but let it slide off my radar screen.
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: DavidR on November 08, 2012, 05:38:11 PM
They are the ones that actually collate the data of a survey, google will give you a lot more information.
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: bob3160 on November 08, 2012, 06:53:33 PM
I think they should have re-opened the Off-Topic Forum and allowed the discussions in there.  ;D
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: Lisandro on November 09, 2012, 12:42:13 AM
I think they should have re-opened the Off-Topic Forum and allowed the discussions in there.  ;D
I think they will never open it again...
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: polonus on November 09, 2012, 12:50:23 AM
Hi Tech and bob3160,

The off topic, I agree with Tech, I have reason to believe it will stay in the realm of wishful thinking, not becoming reality,

polonus

P.S. ManyQs, your user name means that these questions can be solved by using a search engine or even one visit of wikipedia's:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SurveyMonkey
Learn to search here: http://www.searchlores.org/indexo.htm

D
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: ManyQs on November 09, 2012, 06:03:36 AM
An old trick, polonus.  Patronize someone to make them go away. 

Or make them post something that allows management to lock the thread.  Very interesting.  I must have forgotten something, because I didn't recall you being that sort.

You really think I don't know how to use search engines?  You haven't seen me reference search engines in any of my previous posts?  Like I checked this site's search engine.  Or I checked that company's search engine.  You've never seen me write such like that?

Somehow I think you do know that I am fully cognizant of the value of search engines, but you suspected what my next question was going to be and you felt the nasty route was the way to thwart that next question. 

And you were right.  It's the old saying about a dog knowing whether he's been tripped over or kicked.

But that point about search engines allows me to offer a parting gift on this issue to those that wish to be proactive instead of reactive.  Stick this into your favorite search engine: "A few weeks ago, Thomas Goddard"
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: ManyQs on November 09, 2012, 06:09:00 AM
I think they should have re-opened the Off-Topic Forum and allowed the discussions in there.  ;D

Why would this go into an off-topic forum?  We're not allowed to asked for security safeguards from our security provider?  This is a topic/thread about something that Avast did, isn't it?  Are you so very sure, bob3160, what the Avast definition of "anonymous" is?

Off-topic, eh?
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: -midnight on November 09, 2012, 12:36:31 PM
Wondering why this thread is still open since the election is over.  Some people still unhappy about the survey?

Edit..........None of my business so please ignore.
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: Para-Noid on November 09, 2012, 03:44:03 PM
Guys..."let it go"! Please  ;D
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: Coolmario88 on November 09, 2012, 04:00:18 PM
Guys..."let it go"! Please  ;D
+1
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: Kilia on November 10, 2012, 06:53:26 AM
Guys..."let it go"! Please  ;D
+1
+2
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: bob3160 on November 10, 2012, 02:30:57 PM
I think they should have re-opened the Off-Topic Forum and allowed the discussions in there.  ;D

Why would this go into an off-topic forum?  We're not allowed to asked for security safeguards from our security provider?  This is a topic/thread about something that Avast did, isn't it?  Are you so very sure, bob3160, what the Avast definition of "anonymous" is?

Off-topic, eh?

Simply because Politics where always discussed in the Off-Topic Forum when it was still in use.
(Please stop looking for a deeper or hidden meaning when one doesn't exist.)
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: DBone on November 10, 2012, 07:00:15 PM
I don't consider this thread off topic, or about politics in any way shape or form. It is about whether or not avast! should have included an "off topic" pop-up advertisement within their product. It wasn't a pop-up promoting a paid version of their product, but rather a pop-up regarding an issue that has nothing to do with computer security. My interpretation of the definition of adware is a piece of software that displays unwanted and unsolicited advertisements. If I wanted my security product to ask me my personal opinion regarding US politics, then I would have asked them for such a feature.

All of this "off topic" talk is just a way for people to direct the discussion away from the actual issue, which is, is it acceptable for your security product to invade a users privacy simply because they can?

Title: Re: US Presidential Electioff the radar.on survey???
Post by: bob3160 on November 10, 2012, 10:24:11 PM
The answer to your question is very simple: NO
Not replying to the question and not completing the survey keeps your IP  off the radar.
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: polonus on November 10, 2012, 11:19:47 PM
Hi ManyQs,

I am not a man of tricks, nor to patronize here. I am very well aware that the Internet can be used like a hammer. A hammer can sculpt beautiful things and also could provide for a means to ruin. Online tracking is going on in all sorts of hidden obfuscated ways and while the pay-model to deliver so-called free services like we find on the Internet is payed through/from revenues from selling users profile data in the broadest sense of the word, then this tracking can also be abused. One model is criminals trying to earn from fraudulent clicks, so-called malvertisers try to do this. There are more ways of abuse and that is dubious by design to say the least. As the larger part of the user community is not aware of what is going on under the hood of their user agent (e.g. browser) the methods are performed in a stealth way. Not everybody has the ability to analyze their browser session with Wireshark or has the means to make web beacons visible or an extension like Collusion to show what other sites share qua information from the main site. The average user just knows that there are cookies and how to delete them. We have cookie laws now in Europe. But the profilers do not care about cookies, because there are many, many other ways left to get a user profile. These data land on the desk of decision makers all the way and it could also be they are being used to influence consumer habits and in this case voter decisions (I presume the action was driven by enthusiastic voter(s) by their own initiative)

polonus

P.S. And user tracking is going on vertially on all sites. The following site has a hidden iframe on it  and a pixel by pixel web beacon:
at http://cache2-styles.pressdisplay.com/res/en-us/g979/t85001273/images/1x1.gif
hxtp://chinadaily.newspaperdirect.com/epaper/viewer.aspx  link from China Daily by NATASHA SINGER and CHARLES DUHIGG
The article rank is still gathering data in my browser  :D

D
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: ManyQs on November 11, 2012, 01:28:19 AM
The answer to your question is very simple: NO

Then the company shouldn't be doing it, right?

Let's put it in this light.  A new person to the Internet and one not so versed in the ways of the Internet has just been told that this company has a good security product and trusts his/her friend and so trusts this company.  They signed up for Avast a couple of weeks ago.  Suddenly they see their security company putting that survey up there and they do remember what their trusted friend had said about not clicking on strange things, but wait ... THIS is their trusted security company introduced to them by a trusted individual.  Must be okay.  Bingo! -- A sucker sucked into what!?

And you also made note of something, bob3160, which concerns me and is the reason I asked the question about what this company's definition of "anonymous" is. 

Not replying to the question and not completing the survey keeps your IP  off the radar.

You stated what I think is what you believe and what worried me from the get-go -- concerns about the IP address. 

How far along in that data packet you put on the Internet when you did that survey (if you did) does one's IP address follow the data you inputted?  That is the number one question, if I may be so bold.  Obviously, bob3160, it is of some concern to you, too.  So we have similar thoughts on one point.

Now you might see the situation about the trusted friend introducing the trusted company to a novice as where others may have some concerns about another aspect of this business.

Oh yes, and these two concerns outlined above have nothing to do with politics and is why I indicated earlier this is not off-topic for being right here where it is.

This is a topic generated by the company because the company, the CEO, allowed this event to take place. 

... ... ... ... ...

AND, polonus, thank you for your clarification and I apologize for being quite harsh with my words.  I'll reflect on my misdeed and try to be more careful in future.

.. ... ... ... ...

EDIT to fix the thread topic title!  That was not nice somebody!!  This IS NOT ABOUT THE FRIGGIN' ELECTION!!!!!!!!!!!!
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: polonus on November 11, 2012, 02:00:36 AM
Hi ManyQs,

Again you have to consider "the trivial environment of social networking" in which this was presented. This is what we get back from initiatives like twitter, facebook and SurveyMonkey like to operate in these "realms" because it is "loose and casual". That is why I personally do not participate in facebook and twitter etc. for instance because of implications that youngsters often forget and may work against them later. I think the informal presentation is a point to consider.
The informal nature of social internet makes it easier for users to participate. What should we say? This needs more awareness. This is like it is and it is a sign of the times. Or everybody on the net is doing this, so why not?

polonus
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: bob3160 on November 11, 2012, 02:04:10 AM
Quote
How far along in that data packet you put on the Internet when you did that survey (if you did) does one's IP address follow the data you inputted?  That is the number one question, if I may be so bold.  Obviously,bob3160, it is of some concern to you, too.  So we have similar thoughts on one point.
I didn't take the survey.
I also don't care about IP tracking. If I did, I wouldn't be on the internet. :)
I certainly wouldn't make all the posts about where I am and what I'm doing in the following thread:
http://forum.avast.com/index.php?topic=78426.msg647360#msg647360 (http://forum.avast.com/index.php?topic=78426.msg647360#msg647360)

Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: ManyQs on November 11, 2012, 02:16:36 AM
Quote
How far along in that data packet you put on the Internet when you did that survey (if you did) does one's IP address follow the data you inputted?  That is the number one question, if I may be so bold.  Obviously,bob3160, it is of some concern to you, too.  So we have similar thoughts on one point.
I didn't take the survey.
I also don't care about IP tracking. If I did, I wouldn't be on the internet. :)
I certainly wouldn't make all the posts about where I am and what I'm doing in the following thread:
http://forum.avast.com/index.php?topic=78426.msg647360#msg647360 (http://forum.avast.com/index.php?topic=78426.msg647360#msg647360)

Fair enough.

But there are some that don't yet know the ins-and-outs and may get suckered into something they wouldn't allow themselves to get suckered into if they knew.  Those are the people a security company should be most interested in helping.

And in all fairness to the CEO, Vincent Steckler, that survey might have been all a bunch of fun stuff and no third-party received any information as the information was sent to wherever it was sent -- the Avast server only? -- it may have all been in fun, fun, fun, BUT I think a little more disclosure in that Blog post would have been a tad bit more PR savvy.  Coming right out and stating in a direct way a person's IP address was immediately changed to some kind of code that could in no way be tracked back to the original IP address would have been a smart move.  IF that is the case.  Or some other kind of programming that dumped the IP address.  I mean, it's obvious the IP address has to be dumped somehow, or that is a problem, no?

Anyway, bob3160, I got your point about your own concerns.

Me, I'm concerned about the person that's not concerned about the novice.

... ... ... ... ...

EDIT to clarify my own views.
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: bob3160 on November 11, 2012, 04:08:18 AM
My last point.
There isn't anything that would have been exposed by any one taking that survey that isn't already exposed
simply by using the internet.
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: ManyQs on November 11, 2012, 04:41:21 AM
Nothing that wouldn't already have been known except possibly an individual's political leanings matched with a static IP address.

And what about that novice that didn't know they shouldn't have done the survey?  That's no big deal?

Yeah, to hell with the novice that doesn't know any better.  Best they learn the hard way.  And via their Internet Security Service.  Best way to learn those hard lessons.  Through the ones you thought you could trust.

ATCs used to have an expression about that, but I don't know about these days.  After that US president fella fired all of them they may be more politically correct in thier style.   
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: bob3160 on November 11, 2012, 04:48:21 AM
Sorry but I think you're going totally off base.
Ip address is known the second you use the computer on line.
Political affiliation is known the second you register to vote.
Neither of these 2 items are important or dangerous peaces of information to reveal.

Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: polonus on November 11, 2012, 01:18:28 PM
Hi ManyQs,

Also bob3160 has some valid points. Everybody that goes on the Internet as it is being run to-day should always have at the back of his/her/it's head that he/she or it is "fully transparent". We should not be "lulled asleep". Check your IP info here: http://www.clientip.net and this is only a benevolent service, malcreants get loads and loads more of  info. Your complete surfing history can easily be reconstructed, and all these "interrelated" data are being used. But the same trails you leave everywhere when you do things in the virtual world, using a credit card, using your shop club card, paying in the supestore for instance help them to know what to order and when and in what quantities. You have smart meters, you have pin-pointed geo-location. If you do not want to be part of this "grid", seek a cage of Faraday or step out of the virtual world alltogether. Banks do not have cashiers anymore, so you may meet with some problems there.
Agree with you, ManyQs, that a lot of youngsters are not fully aware of these facts all the time and all of the time and later it could be that they cannot apply for a job as  they could feel the reverse effects of their facebook history and what they might have put online as a 13 year old. So yes, what you do online you do "in public". Going online is never a private thing and it never has been.
That is why a lot of users try to use anonymizing services like proxies like vtunnel etc. They again should be aware that all they do there is being logged as everything on the net is being logged. About the survey etc. I do not know anything about it, all that would be pure speculation....

polonus
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: ManyQs on November 11, 2012, 03:25:07 PM
Sorry but I think you're going totally off base.
Ip address is known the second you use the computer on line.
Political affiliation is known the second you register to vote.
Neither of these 2 items are important or dangerous peaces of information to reveal.

It's a shame there are folks that have folded and have given in to big business or even Homeland Security and don't think there's any need to defend an individual's right to protection from those that would abuse data mining.

I'm not sure, but there might be something from the EU on the subject in this directive: http://europa.eu/legislation_summaries/information_society/data_protection/l14012_en.htm

It is rather ironic, too, that this very company chose to publicize some sort of information related to data mining, although I'm still waiting to find out where that information is stored.

That is, I'm waiting for some answers here: http://forum.avast.com/index.php?topic=109142.0

And I'll provide the link now to that article I alluded to in an earlier post in this thread:

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/28/us/politics/tracking-clicks-online-to-try-to-sway-voters.html?pagewanted=all

And a snippet from that article from the New York Times which points to some other folks actually having some concerns:

Quote

... ... ... truncated ... ... ...
 
There is growing concern that the campaigns or third-party trackers may later use that voter data for purposes the public never imagined, like excluding someone from a job offer based on his or her past political affiliations.

“Is the data going to be sold to marketers or shared with other campaigns?” said Christopher Calabrese, the legislative counsel for privacy-related issues at the American Civil Liberties Union. “We simply don’t know how this information is going to be used in the future and where it is going to end up.”

... ... ... truncated ... ... ...



Oh well, to each his/her own. 

I think, though, it's a good thing there are some that have not thrown in their cards and left the table.
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: bob3160 on November 11, 2012, 03:47:45 PM
Actually, if you're on the internet, you are already on the radar screen.
There isn't any way to avoid it.
Title: Re: US Presidential Election survey???
Post by: Kilia on November 11, 2012, 07:01:35 PM
Here is a small program I use quite alot for domain and IP information. It's an oldie but a goodie and it's free.

http://www.karenware.com/powertools/ptwhois.asp