Author Topic: <iframe> alert is minimalist  (Read 8014 times)

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Musaran

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<iframe> alert is minimalist
« on: April 06, 2005, 02:37:14 PM »
I installed avast for a friend, and here is what she got :
Quote
From: avast! 4
To:
Date:
Subject: [avast! heuristique - AVERTISSEMENT]

----
tag <iframe> trouvé, cela peut être dangereux

Expéditeur :  "Voyages-sncf.com" <reply@voyages-sncf.com>
Destinataire :  sylvie.bricout@free.fr
Sujet :  Récapitulatif_de_votre_commande
.
And that scares her (she is not technically aware).

What is wrong :
-Doesn't say it is an anti-virus alert/message.
-Not clear about what happened.
-Doesn't say it replaced the message.
-Message is lost.


Here is what I suggest :
Quote
From: avast! 4 anti-virus
To:
Date:
Subject: [mail rated dangerous and quarantined (heuristic scan)]

----
Avast! 4 anti-virus notification

A mail sent to you contains <iframe> in html code, wich can be dangerous.
This is commonly used by advertisement and malware.

The mail is in quarantine and awaits your decision :
To preview in a safe but limited version, click here.
To receive it, click here.
To destroy it, click here.

Here is a short extract of the mail :
(from)
(to)
(subject)

(first lines from message)

Offline igor

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Re: <iframe> alert is minimalist
« Reply #1 on: April 06, 2005, 03:21:25 PM »
-Doesn't say it is an anti-virus alert/message.

The subject says "avast! heuristic - WARNING", so I believe it is stated that it comes from (or rather, through) the antivirus.

-Not clear about what happened.
-Doesn't say it replaced the message.
-Message is lost.

Before this e-mail arrived to the mailbox, the "avast! Heuristic Warning" dialog must have appeared, asking the user what to do with the e-mail. Only after the user selected to delete the message, it was deleted.

To preview in a safe but limited version, click here.
To receive it, click here.
To destroy it, click here.

I'm afraid this is not possible to achieve. The e-mail client may not even support hyperlinks, and even if it did, I really don't know how such an action could be invoked through it. Basically, what you are suggesting is the dialog that was displayed before the e-mail was received.

Musaran

  • Guest
Re: <iframe> alert is minimalist
« Reply #2 on: April 06, 2005, 04:08:32 PM »
The subject says "avast! heuristic - WARNING", so I believe it is stated that it comes from (or rather, through) the antivirus.
Just as I said : It doesn't specify anti-virus, only "avast".
I know what avast means, my friend doesn't.
Don't even bother with "heuristic"...


Before this e-mail arrived to the mailbox, the "avast! Heuristic Warning" dialog must have appeared, asking the user what to do with the e-mail. Only after the user selected to delete the message, it was deleted.
My friend didn't tell me about that. :-[
(She really is not technically aware, any dialog gets clicked away.)

If you had a testing service to send/download fake malware, I would have tried myself.
(I haven't even bothered to check  ;))

Neverthless, the substitute email (if any) could be more explicit.

Offline Lisandro

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Re: <iframe> alert is minimalist
« Reply #3 on: April 06, 2005, 04:31:47 PM »
I know what avast means, my friend doesn't.
Is she the same as you mentioned here: http://forum.avast.com/index.php?topic=12602.msg106376#msg106376
If so, it will be better if she take some time to read and learn...
Does she install a program (avast) without knowing what does it do?

Don't even bother with "heuristic"...
(She really is not technically aware, any dialog gets clicked away.)
Well, this is like an airplane pilot clicking the buttons and praying to land safe  ;D

If you had a testing service to send/download fake malware, I would have tried myself.
(I haven't even bothered to check  ;))
Neverthless, the substitute email (if any) could be more explicit.
Well, you asked, we answered... But you're not bothered to learn, are you?  ;)
The best things in life are free.

Musaran

  • Guest
Re: <iframe> alert is minimalist
« Reply #4 on: April 06, 2005, 07:07:05 PM »
(Finally I keep it here, it is not really a "feature")

Quote
Is she the same as you mentioned here: http://forum.avast.com/index.php?topic=12602.msg106376#msg106376
I didn't mention her... i was speaking of users in general.

Quote
If so, it will be better if she take some time to read and learn...
Does she install a program (avast) without knowing what does it do?
I choose, install, configure and fix for her.
She wouldn't know, and has other matters to tend in life.

Quote
Well, this is like an airplane pilot clicking the buttons and praying to land safe  ;D
Autopilot !
In this particular case, the program is more apt than the clueless user to decide.
I will just activate silent mode, lower security, trust avast to still catch pests, and pray.  ;D

Quote
Well, you asked, we answered... But you're not bothered to learn, are you?  ;)
I am, but if I spend the necessary time to learn the ins and out of every bit of software I/my computer needs, I would spend my life on it.
In fact, I already do...


The technically impaired (as the above-mentionned)...
...can't spend time reading the documentation, because it would eat more time than the little they allot to get the thing done.
...won't really learn, because they forget between each use.
...don't known "what program you are in" or "what was the title of the window", it is just "it".
...consider unexpected dialogs severe (otherwise why bother them), or routine (and click them away). Content matters little, since they understand it little.

When faced with them, I take a hudge step back, think about it, and realise they are RIGHT.
  • Spending more time learning than using means it is not self-teaching.
  • Knowing it's inward details means it is not serving the user correctly.
  • Re-learning the same things mean it is not intuitive.
  • Fetching the documentation means it is too complicated.
  • Remembering it means it can't work by itself.

It doesn't need to be obscure and complicated.
Often a well-thought and carefull design is intuitive and self-teaching : easy at the start, and the more it is used the more it is understood.


Well, this brought me kind of little far off-topic, never mind.

neiby

  • Guest
Re: <iframe> alert is minimalist
« Reply #5 on: April 06, 2005, 07:25:01 PM »
The technically impaired (as the above-mentionned)...
...can't spend time reading the documentation, because it would eat more time than the little they allot to get the thing done.
...won't really learn, because they forget between each use.
...don't known "what program you are in" or "what was the title of the window", it is just "it".
...consider unexpected dialogs severe (otherwise why bother them), or routine (and click them away). Content matters little, since they understand it little.

When faced with them, I take a hudge step back, think about it, and realise they are RIGHT.
  • Spending more time learning than using means it is not self-teaching.
  • Knowing it's inward details means it is not serving the user correctly.
  • Re-learning the same things mean it is not intuitive.
  • Fetching the documentation means it is too complicated.
  • Remembering it means it can't work by itself.

It doesn't need to be obscure and complicated.
Often a well-thought and carefull design is intuitive and self-teaching : easy at the start, and the more it is used the more it is understood.


Well, this brought me kind of little far off-topic, never mind.

There is much wisdom here. Alwil (and anyone else who designs applications for non-technical end users) would do well to try to understand what musaran is really saying here. He is not attacking Alwil or Avast, he is simply suggesting ways to improve it and to make it easier to use for non-technical users.

I still think that Avast! is the best AV around but that does not mean it is perfect and can't be improved.

Offline essexboy

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Re: <iframe> alert is minimalist
« Reply #6 on: April 06, 2005, 07:47:38 PM »
Quote
If you had a testing service to send/download fake malware, I would have tried myself.
(I haven't even bothered to check  Wink)


Try this link they will send about 15 bad e-mails my ISP catches 1 ZAPro catches 2 or 3 Avast gets the rest..


http://www.gfi.com/emailsecuritytest/

Musaran

  • Guest
Re: <iframe> alert is minimalist
« Reply #7 on: April 07, 2005, 04:07:14 PM »
I still think that Avast! is the best AV around but that does not mean it is perfect and can't be improved.
Right on !
I know why I use avast!, and think perfecting it would allow anyone to appreciate it's use.

essexboy  : thank you.

Offline DavidR

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