Author Topic: [Solved] W10, Avast and the strength of Defender  (Read 4200 times)

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Offline =Snake=

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[Solved] W10, Avast and the strength of Defender
« on: April 07, 2019, 12:56:57 PM »
Hello,

everytime I start my W10 machine, Avast is deactivated by Defender!
Quote
What can I do (see screenshots after Avast virus update)?
As you can see in my second screenshot: Avast is set to 'automatic', but why didn't start?
Another question: what will happen, if I start Avast via services?
You can't deactivate Defender in W10 via services!  ???
So, if anybody has a hint, answer please.

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« Last Edit: April 10, 2019, 12:17:29 AM by =Snake= »
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Offline Asyn

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Re: W10, Avast and the strength of Defender
« Reply #1 on: April 07, 2019, 06:12:32 PM »
- Which Avast..? (Free/Pro/IS/Premier)
- Which version..?
- OS..? (32/64 Bit..? - which SP/Build..?)
- Other security related software installed..?
- Which AV(s) did you use before Avast..?
Win 8.1 [x64] - Avast PremSec 20.6.2416.B#1 [UI.537] - CC 5.68 - EEK - FF ESR 68.10 [NS/AOS/uBO/PB] - TB 68.10 - SB/CP/SL/DU.BC
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Re: W10, Avast and the strength of Defender
« Reply #2 on: April 07, 2019, 10:25:14 PM »
This should work the other way around, defender should deactivate with Avast installed.  Which Avast product did you install? Please see Asyn's questions above to give us some more information
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Offline =Snake=

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Re: W10, Avast and the strength of Defender
« Reply #3 on: April 07, 2019, 10:35:03 PM »
- 1. Which Avast..? (Free/Pro/IS/Premier)
- 2. Which version..?
- 3. OS..? (32/64 Bit..? - which SP/Build..?)
- 4. Other security related software installed..?
- 5. Which AV(s) did you use before Avast..?
1: Free
2: 2015.10.4.2233
3: See my sig and screenshot.
4: See my sig.
5: Can't remember, I started using Avast Free  ~1994.
« Last Edit: April 07, 2019, 10:36:37 PM by =Snake= »
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Re: W10, Avast and the strength of Defender
« Reply #4 on: April 07, 2019, 10:45:05 PM »
Any reason for still being on a 10.4 release of avast? I am sure this is one possibility of why Defender inst correctly detecting Avast and disabling itself. Would it be possible for you to update to the current release, or at least to the 18.x branch which is also still supported?
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Re: W10, Avast and the strength of Defender
« Reply #5 on: April 07, 2019, 11:10:33 PM »
1. Any reason for still being on a 10.4 release of avast? I am sure this is one possibility of why Defender inst correctly detecting Avast and disabling itself.
2. Would it be possible for you to update to the current release, or at least to the 18.x branch which is also still supported?
1: Yes, for Avast newer versions are not able (caused by nw scans) to recognize my router right.
     Therefore I rolled back to this version.
     Before that I got error messages like 'your router isn't configuered right', 'WEAK_PASS' or 'ftp error'.
2: According to the reasons: NO!
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Offline DavidR

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Re: W10, Avast and the strength of Defender
« Reply #6 on: April 07, 2019, 11:33:40 PM »
1. Any reason for still being on a 10.4 release of avast? I am sure this is one possibility of why Defender inst correctly detecting Avast and disabling itself.
2. Would it be possible for you to update to the current release, or at least to the 18.x branch which is also still supported?
1: Yes, for Avast newer versions are not able (caused by nw scans) to recognize my router right.
     Therefore I rolled back to this version.
     Before that I got error messages like 'your router isn't configuered right', 'WEAK_PASS' or 'ftp error'.
2: According to the reasons: NO!


1:  If you had the latest avast 19.3 version for those systems on win7 or higher (assuming that the CPUs support the SSE2 instruction set). 

The XP SP3 systems in theory should be able to run version 18.8.xxxx (on my XP Pro SP3 I have avast! free 18.5.2342 (as I had problems with 18.6 and above).  They too would also require the CPUs support the SSE2 instruction set.

EDIT Final point:
Do you get these network errors after running a scan ?
I would o a custom install and don't install the WiFi Inspector if that is what is causing the router/network detection/errors.
« Last Edit: April 07, 2019, 11:40:59 PM by DavidR »
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Re: W10, Avast and the strength of Defender
« Reply #7 on: April 07, 2019, 11:46:39 PM »
1. Any reason for still being on a 10.4 release of avast? I am sure this is one possibility of why Defender inst correctly detecting Avast and disabling itself.
2. Would it be possible for you to update to the current release, or at least to the 18.x branch which is also still supported?
1: Yes, for Avast newer versions are not able (caused by nw scans) to recognize my router right.
     Therefore I rolled back to this version.
     Before that I got error messages like 'your router isn't configuered right', 'WEAK_PASS' or 'ftp error'.
2: According to the reasons: NO!


1:  If you had the latest avast 19.3 version for those systems on win7 or higher (assuming that the CPUs support the SSE2 instruction set). 

The XP SP3 systems in theory should be able to run version 18.8.xxxx (on my XP Pro SP3 I have avast! free 18.5.2342 (as I had problems with 18.6 and above).  They too would also require the CPUs support the SSE2 instruction set.
Hi David!

All that I tried several months before and I have cpus with and without SSE2 support.
Main: AMD LE1620,W7ult SP1 | MS-7091,P4,XP pro SP3 | AMD-Athlon 1800+ (W7ult SP1 + XP pro SP3,FFesr 45.9,TB 45.8,CC 5.11)|
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Offline DavidR

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Re: W10, Avast and the strength of Defender
« Reply #8 on: April 08, 2019, 01:41:48 AM »
1. Any reason for still being on a 10.4 release of avast? I am sure this is one possibility of why Defender inst correctly detecting Avast and disabling itself.
2. Would it be possible for you to update to the current release, or at least to the 18.x branch which is also still supported?
1: Yes, for Avast newer versions are not able (caused by nw scans) to recognize my router right.
     Therefore I rolled back to this version.
     Before that I got error messages like 'your router isn't configuered right', 'WEAK_PASS' or 'ftp error'.
2: According to the reasons: NO!


1:  If you had the latest avast 19.3 version for those systems on win7 or higher (assuming that the CPUs support the SSE2 instruction set). 

The XP SP3 systems in theory should be able to run version 18.8.xxxx (on my XP Pro SP3 I have avast! free 18.5.2342 (as I had problems with 18.6 and above).  They too would also require the CPUs support the SSE2 instruction set.
Hi David!

All that I tried several months before and I have cpus with and without SSE2 support.


That certainly puts a crimp in what you are able to do, version wise.

I made an edit on my last post, I don't know if you saw that, just trying to find when you get these errors and see if there is a way round that.

Do you get these network errors after running a scan ?
I would do a custom install and don't install/uninstall the WiFi Inspector (if that is even in 10.4) if that is what is causing the router/network detection/errors.
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Windows 10 Home 1909 64bit/ Acer Aspire F15/ Intel Core i5 7200U 2.5GHz, 8GB DDR4 memory, 256GB SSD, 1TB HDD/ avast! free 20.5.2415 (build 20.5.5410.561) UI-1.0.532/ WinPatrol+/ Firefox, uBlock Origin, uMatrix/ MailWasher Pro

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Re: W10, Avast and the strength of Defender
« Reply #9 on: April 08, 2019, 10:10:46 AM »
1. Any reason for still being on a 10.4 release of avast? I am sure this is one possibility of why Defender inst correctly detecting Avast and disabling itself.
2. Would it be possible for you to update to the current release, or at least to the 18.x branch which is also still supported?
1: Yes, for Avast newer versions are not able (caused by nw scans) to recognize my router right.
     Therefore I rolled back to this version.
     Before that I got error messages like 'your router isn't configuered right', 'WEAK_PASS' or 'ftp error'.
2: According to the reasons: NO!

1:  If you had the latest avast 19.3 version for those systems on win7 or higher (assuming that the CPUs support the SSE2 instruction set). 
The XP SP3 systems in theory should be able to run version 18.8.xxxx (on my XP Pro SP3 I have avast! free 18.5.2342 (as I had problems with 18.6 and above).  They too would also require the CPUs support the SSE2 instruction set.
Hi David!
All that I tried several months before and I have cpus with and without SSE2 support.

1. That certainly puts a crimp in what you are able to do, version wise.
2. I made an edit on my last post, I don't know if you saw that, just trying to find when you get these errors and see if there is a way round that.
3. Do you get these network errors after running a scan ?
4. I would do a custom install and don't install/uninstall the WiFi Inspector (if that is even in 10.4) if that is what is causing the router/network detection/errors.

1: Could you write that with other words, please?
2: I did.
3: Yes. Whenever the wifi Inspector was involved and several times I tried to push the Devs to correct it.
4: As you know, I have several machines with several os from XP to W10 and I had several Avast
    versions from 18.5, 18.8 to 19.1 and all they showed me the first two errors. During my try to test
    19.3. beta I got the third error message with the 'ftp' error, but my router has no 'ftp' section!
    So I gave up treating the Devs to the right direction.
    Since a lot of years I only do custom installs and so I rolled back to 10.4.2233 for it's the only one,
    which recognized my router right, so I got no error messages.

Only one machine with XP and W7 is on another flat and without SSE2 support. All machines without any special notice (e.g. x64) are x86.
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Offline DavidR

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Re: W10, Avast and the strength of Defender
« Reply #10 on: April 08, 2019, 11:48:34 AM »
@  =Snake=
1:  Crimp = Makes it very difficult with the different mix of systems with XP CPUs that don't support SSE2 instruction set.  They are pretty much going to be stuck on the old 10.4 version of Avast.

3.  I don't know if this is just a case of not detecting you router correctly.  As it is reporting  'WEAK_PASS' I don't think that wouldn't really be directly related to incorrectly detecting the router. 

The weak password could be one of a few things, it is truly weak, very short or in some cases the default password (Admin Password)  that you get when first got it and hasn't been changed.  It could also be that the Encryption level used on the WiFi router older models had a weaker encryption level I think WPA2 would only be on newer WiFi routers.  See https://routersecurity.org/ for more general information.

I'm not sure if the ftp error is router related as ftp (File Transfer Protocol) I would say is OS related. Though on my XP Pro SP3 system I haven't experienced this error.

Unfortunately with old versions of Avast coupled with, old unsupported OS versions, I don't believe the Devs would be spending time on it.  That may not be their decision as any retrospective fixes on old/unsupported versions would have to be authorised higher up the chain of management.

4:  I'm not sure there is anything else I can add here that hasn't been covered.
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Re: W10, Avast and the strength of Defender
« Reply #11 on: April 08, 2019, 01:40:35 PM »
@  =Snake=
1:  Crimp = Makes it very difficult with the different mix of systems with XP CPUs that don't support SSE2 instruction set.  They are pretty much going to be stuck on the old 10.4 version of Avast.

3.  I don't know if this is just a case of not detecting you router correctly.  As it is reporting  'WEAK_PASS' I don't think that wouldn't really be directly related to incorrectly detecting the router. 

The weak password could be one of a few things, it is truly weak, very short or in some cases the default password (Admin Password)  that you get when first got it and hasn't been changed.  It could also be that the Encryption level used on the WiFi router older models had a weaker encryption level I think WPA2 would only be on newer WiFi routers.  See https://routersecurity.org/ for more general information.

I'm not sure if the ftp error is router related as ftp (File Transfer Protocol) I would say is OS related. Though on my XP Pro SP3 system I haven't experienced this error.

Unfortunately with old versions of Avast coupled with, old unsupported OS versions, I don't believe the Devs would be spending time on it.  That may not be their decision as any retrospective fixes on old/unsupported versions would have to be authorised higher up the chain of management.

4:  I'm not sure there is anything else I can add here that hasn't been covered.

To 1: Thanks for your explanation. As you can see in my sig, if you have a machine with no SSE2
         support, all other sw has to be hold on lower level.
To 3: Concerning my router: when we changed our home at the end og 2016, I had to change my
          internet provider, too, for they didn't support DSL anymore.
          Then I got a new simple router with WPA2, which works fine until Avast told me such nonsense.
          I think, it was a W10 machine, that brought the 'ftp' error and in the meantime I installed W8.1
          on one of them. So I have only 1, which has no CD/DVD recorder, but big SSD hd.
To 4: I would ask you about trying to start Avast via services. What do you think? I'm not sure , if Avast
         will deactivate one of the 2 Defender av-tools (see my first screenshot) or will the manual start of
         Avast fail?
Edit:tipo
« Last Edit: April 08, 2019, 01:52:46 PM by =Snake= »
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Offline stibi

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Re: W10, Avast and the strength of Defender
« Reply #12 on: April 08, 2019, 03:58:22 PM »
What's the reason for running 2 AV tools at the same time?

Offline bob3160

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Re: W10, Avast and the strength of Defender
« Reply #13 on: April 08, 2019, 04:31:47 PM »
When you run an outdated version of a third party AV, you receive a warning from Defender.
It's quite possible that the version of Avast that you are using isn't accepted as valid protection and Defender
simply takes over. It's similar to not having another Av present on your system.
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Re: W10, Avast and the strength of Defender
« Reply #14 on: April 08, 2019, 04:43:56 PM »
When you run an outdated version of a third party AV, you receive a warning from Defender.
It's quite possible that the version of Avast that you are using isn't accepted as valid protection and Defender
simply takes over. It's similar to not having another Av present on your system.

I didn't receive any warning from Defender. So I'll try starting Avast manually via services and see, what happens.
Main: AMD LE1620,W7ult SP1 | MS-7091,P4,XP pro SP3 | AMD-Athlon 1800+ (W7ult SP1 + XP pro SP3,FFesr 45.9,TB 45.8,CC 5.11)|
Laptops: Acer Aspire V5-591G,W10 Home[x64] v1809 (Build 17763.914) | HPI_2020M,W8.1 pro[x64] | Amilo Xi2428,W8.1 pro | MD95400,W7ult SP1 | MD97400,XP pro SP3|
FF 68.8.0esr[NS,AOS,ABP],TB 68.8.0,MCS,CC 5.66,MBAM,MBAE, FW (XP+W7):CIS 3.14[FW,D+],AV:Avast Free [XP+W7:10.4.2233] 19.8.2393|