Author Topic: Windows Defender and avast  (Read 2269 times)

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Offline billygoat319

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Windows Defender and avast
« on: December 31, 2022, 03:40:41 PM »
Hi

I reset windows 11  Version 22H2  OS Build 22621 -193

Avast Premium Security  version 22.126044 build 22.12 .7758.769

Checked Task manager and Found Antimalware Service Executable Process  (Microsoft defender Antivirus Service ) Process running.)

Uninstalled Avast turned of Windows Defender from real time scanning.
Reinstalled Avast but still have Windows defender process running in Task manager.


In Windows Security
In Virus and Threat Protection  Avast is showing.

I know not good idea to have 2 antivirus working.


 EDIT: Just noticed I am receiving  (Security Intelligence Update for Microsoft Defender Antivirus)
when I check windows update, never had these before when I use Avast.
« Last Edit: December 31, 2022, 08:22:42 PM by billygoat319 »

Offline waking

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Re: Windows Defender and avast
« Reply #1 on: December 31, 2022, 04:44:39 PM »
Some immediate thoughts that spring to mind:

(1) You can't turn off Defender if no 3rd party AV is installed.
    It will turn itself back on as soon as it detects that you
    have no protection running.
   
(2) Defender can be configured to do periodic scans without
    interfering with a 3rd party AV realtime protection. If
    that occurs then Defender will naturally be running when
    you check task manager.
   
(3) Some components of Defender may be running at all times. even
    though realtime protection is off. e.g. - Smartscreen,
    Intelligence updates, etc.

(4) It is Windows itself that controls whether or not Defender
    is active at any given time and which components.
   

Offline billygoat319

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Re: Windows Defender and avast
« Reply #2 on: December 31, 2022, 04:55:50 PM »
Thanks for your assistance, much appreciated.

 (2) I don't have Defender set up for periodic scans.

 (3) Possible. Its running  every time I check Task Manager.

 (4) Okay thanks.

Just on my other desktop same set up I have not noticed defender running in Task manager.

Cheers

Offline bob3160

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Re: Windows Defender and avast
« Reply #3 on: January 01, 2023, 12:55:03 AM »
Thanks for your assistance, much appreciated.

 (2) I don't have Defender set up for periodic scans.

 (3) Possible. Its running  every time I check Task Manager.

 (4) Okay thanks.

Just on my other desktop same set up I have not noticed defender running in Task manager.

Cheers
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Offline billygoat319

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Re: Windows Defender and avast
« Reply #4 on: January 01, 2023, 05:10:47 AM »
bob3160  thanks much appreciated.

May give a go in the near future.

Cheers

Online Dinobot2

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Re: Windows Defender and avast
« Reply #5 on: January 01, 2023, 11:39:15 PM »
As others have alluded to as long as you don't have Real Time Protection turned on with Defender while you have Avast (or any other TPAV) handling Real-time protection, then you're good. When you install Avast, Windows Defender's Real-time scanning should turn off without allowing you the option to turn it back on. Just to be sure, you can always go to Manage Settings from the "Virus & threat protection" area of Windows Security, and see if your screen looks like the attached.

If you don't want Defender Antivirus running at all, you can always just turn off the setting that bob3160 showed.
« Last Edit: January 01, 2023, 11:41:04 PM by Dinobot2 »

Offline bob3160

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Re: Windows Defender and avast
« Reply #6 on: January 02, 2023, 03:41:29 AM »
As others have alluded to as long as you don't have Real Time Protection turned on with Defender while you have Avast (or any other TPAV) handling Real-time protection, then you're good. When you install Avast, Windows Defender's Real-time scanning should turn off without allowing you the option to turn it back on. Just to be sure, you can always go to Manage Settings from the "Virus & threat protection" area of Windows Security, and see if your screen looks like the attached.

If you don't want Defender Antivirus running at all, you can always just turn off the setting that bob3160 showed.
That setting is OFF by default. If you want it, you need to enable it.
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Online Dinobot2

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Re: Windows Defender and avast
« Reply #7 on: January 02, 2023, 04:10:15 AM »
So first off, whether it is on or off by default isn't really relevant here, as it's on for the OP. If he turns that setting off, Windows Defender doesn't run in Task Managers.

Second, I've actually had mixed results on whether it's on or off by default. About a year ago I discovered it was on and regular Defender Smart scans were running and definitions being updated daily as well. Now any time I have uninstalled and re-installed Avast over the last few months, that setting will indeed be Off by default and I have to manually put it back on. On my previous laptop it was also off the entire time.

Offline billygoat319

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Re: Windows Defender and avast
« Reply #8 on: January 02, 2023, 04:41:37 AM »
Hi Dinobot2 Thanks for your assistance.

How do I turn Defender of, as I have manually turned off Defender, installed Avast.  I am still getting  Antimalware Service Executable Process.
I am also getting Defender definitions updates.


I am not the smartest tool in the shed. If i set periodic Scanning on this will turn off real time scanning in defender, or is their another way to turn off Windows defender.

On my Win 10 laptop and other win11 Desktop ( I do not have  Antimalware Service Executable Process or receive any Defender definitions Updates.

Offline Mr. Consumer

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Re: Windows Defender and avast
« Reply #9 on: January 02, 2023, 08:53:31 AM »
This is the new norm in Windows 11 post 22H2 update. The Microsoft Defender service is never going to be killed off, even when third-party AVs are installed.
But Microsoft Defender is not active, it won't access your files or cause any CPU/disk usage. It's just that the process is kept alive in a dormant mode.
I heard it was kept on because of the new SmartAppControl feature of Windows 11. Which could be true, but the process still remains alive even when SAC is kept alive.
Microsoft Defender's signature will also be updated in the background once a day with Windows Update. Otherwise, it'll remain silent so don't worry about it and keep using Avast normally.

Offline billygoat319

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Re: Windows Defender and avast
« Reply #10 on: January 02, 2023, 10:12:51 AM »
Thanks Mr.Consumer  very much apprciated.

Just checked both my desktops both are Windows 11 Pro  Version 22H2  build 22621-963

On DeskTop 1 there is no Antimalware Service Executable Process  (Microsoft defender Antivirus Service ) Process  is Not Running
No defender  definitions are updated.

On Desktop 2 the computer I reset from downloading from the cloud via Microsoft.  Shows (Microsoft defender Antivirus Service  Process running )  Also  Defender definitions are updated .

Confused why Antimalware Service Executable Process  runs on one computer not other one.  One receives defender definitions updates one doesn't  Both are same and both have Avast Premium Security installed.

Online Dinobot2

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Re: Windows Defender and avast
« Reply #11 on: January 02, 2023, 05:15:10 PM »
Hi Dinobot2 Thanks for your assistance.

How do I turn Defender of, as I have manually turned off Defender, installed Avast.  I am still getting  Antimalware Service Executable Process.
I am also getting Defender definitions updates.


I am not the smartest tool in the shed. If i set periodic Scanning on this will turn off real time scanning in defender, or is their another way to turn off Windows defender.

On my Win 10 laptop and other win11 Desktop ( I do not have  Antimalware Service Executable Process or receive any Defender definitions Updates.

You're conflating Defender's Real Time protection with Defender periodic scans and the other stuff that comes along with it being "enabled" in the background. If you have Avast or another third party virus scan enabled, it should (and in Avast's case, does) turn off Defender's real time protection. If you go to the area I mentioned earlier, you should see that Real time protection is off and more importantly can't be turned back on as long as you have Avast installed and running. Real-time protection doesn't have to be on, however, for Windows Defender Antivirus service to run in the background (under the "Antimalware Service Executable" task), as it would still have to run for periodic scans, definitions updates, and other background services such as Tamper protection, Automatic sample submission, etc. That will all be enabled (again, excluding real-time protection) when you have that setting that bob provided a screenshot of.

If you turn that setting off, whether it's off by default or you have to manually turn it off, it should shut off Windows Defender antivirus from running at all. There will be no periodic scans, no definitions updates (except for maybe during the once-a-month cumulative Windows updates), etc. I have provided two screenshots below of the virus & threat protection screen alongside my task bar, one without Defender enabled for period scans, and one with it enabled. Notice how when it's turned off, I don't have the Antimalware Service Executable running. Now, I am still running Windows 10 (version 22H2), and you said you're running Windows 11, but I don't believe that should make a difference with this particular setting and process.

So, now, with all of that said and explained (and I apologize if I repeated anything you already knew), is the issue that even with that optional setting turned off, you're still seeing Antimalware Service Executable with Microsoft Defender Antivirus service (after you expand the task) running in the background?
« Last Edit: January 02, 2023, 05:16:56 PM by Dinobot2 »

Offline billygoat319

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Re: Windows Defender and avast
« Reply #12 on: January 02, 2023, 06:35:53 PM »
Dinobot2  Your explanation is very informative.  8)

Yes I don't have Defender periodic scans turned on at all.

That why I am confused (easily done) one shows Antimalware Service Executable running and other computer not running.

When I reset the computer and reinstalled Avast  I noticed Antimalware Service Executable was running.
Uninstalled Avast rebooted etc, Manually turned off windows defender reinstalled Avast  Premium Security, and found Antimalware Service Executable was running.

Normally when I have reinstalled Avast Windows defender has turned off.

Online Dinobot2

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Re: Windows Defender and avast
« Reply #13 on: January 02, 2023, 07:09:32 PM »
This might be a stupid suggestion, but try turning that setting on, and then off again. See if it removes it running in the background.

I will say, and this is just personal opinion, it's not really a big deal if it runs in the background and gets definitions. As we've established, the real-time protection will be disabled so it won't interfere with Avast. If you're worried about CPU or RAM usage, it uses very little of both when Real-time protection is off. It'll pretty much just do a quick scan in the background once a day when your computer is idle which depending on your computer's speed will take anywhere from 1-5 minutes.

Offline billygoat319

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Re: Windows Defender and avast
« Reply #14 on: January 02, 2023, 07:53:16 PM »
I gave it a shot, but didn't turn it off.

Yea so I will just turn on   periodic scanning.

Your assistance was invaluable, appreciate it  :) :)