Author Topic: BPP console scan schedules not followed by clients. Date/Time screwed?  (Read 10399 times)

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Offline 1tb

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1. We have the BPP scan schedule set to fire at 8:00am on the Default group. However, we noticed that if pc's are switched off at the scheduled time and then back on at 9:00am they also start scanning at that time. WRONG behaviour! 

2. After experimenting with excluding some days, eg, only checking Monday, Wednesday and Friday, we still find the task for a quick scan will fire on Tuesday and Thursday- this must be a bug! How can we make a task that will only scan on the selected days?

3. Our windows regional timezone is Hobart (GMT+10) and our language is set to English Australia, and this sets our windows short date format to dd/mm/yy. However, the time zone appears to be incorrect on the reports (and scan progress/results). The BPP console and reports date/time format do not follow the local host format. Can this please be fixed- something this simple is very unpolished! Is this date/time problem the cause of the bug mentioned in 2 above? If so how can we fix this?


wpn

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Re: BPP console scan schedules not followed by clients. Date/Time screwed?
« Reply #1 on: September 12, 2011, 07:54:36 PM »
1) its good behaviour in my vision
it missed the first window to scan, but you do want to have the scan happening above the chance of having an infection that you would allow to grow because the missed window to scan.
Its unfortuanate for the user that logs in at that moment but on the other hand is the performance of the computer so low that it bothers the user?

2) if no other (default) tasks are scheduled i join u in the conclusion

3) never had any (reporting)program behave propperly with locale settings, really annoying, reports should have more customisation possible such as these locale settings (overwritting them possibly)

Paul Rodgers

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Re: BPP console scan schedules not followed by clients. Date/Time screwed?
« Reply #2 on: September 13, 2011, 12:15:30 AM »
I think there should be an option in the scan setup to wait until the next time the scan is scheduled. I have quick scans configured for weekdays and full scans configured for weekends. If for some reason the scan does not run on a machine I would like to postpone it until after business hours.

Offline 1tb

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Re: BPP console scan schedules not followed by clients. Date/Time screwed?
« Reply #3 on: September 13, 2011, 12:38:41 AM »
I think there should be an option in the scan setup to wait until the next time the scan is scheduled. I have quick scans configured for weekdays and full scans configured for weekends. If for some reason the scan does not run on a machine I would like to postpone it until after business hours.
Agree - this particular client opens at 8:00am but does not get busy until 9:00am. As they switch off pc's overnight (in some areas) we try to capture a scan on those pc's that get switched on early before they get busy. However we don't want pc's that switch on at 9:00 firing up a scan.

@wpn- unfortunately many of our clients have older pc's that barely meet the spec for their line of business app (old P4 with XP Pro on 1MB). Running a scan on these makes their critical app crawl. So in a perfect world we would ask our clients to upgrade everything to support the latest AV? Not feasible, so we want to switch off all unneeded shields (these group of pc's are only used for billing/accounting- not surfing, email or P2P) and tweak the AV to cover the basics with the lowest footprint. Hence the need for more customisation in the BPP console groups (eg have a group for old low spec pc's).

As I seem to recall 'footprint' or lack of it, was a great advantage of avast AV (specifically v4.x) over competitor AV.

Unfortunately avast developers need to be careful that catering for 'feature set' without focusing on 'customer needs for performance and small footprint' is no guarantee of success in the future AV world. Case in point (why enable P2P and IM shields on a server by default? Shields on a server should ONLY be those needed for that machine to optimise the performance vs AV coverage!)

« Last Edit: September 13, 2011, 12:46:28 AM by 1tb »

Offline igor

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Re: BPP console scan schedules not followed by clients. Date/Time screwed?
« Reply #4 on: September 13, 2011, 01:05:21 AM »
A bit off-topic - but IM and P2P Shield use zero resources by themselves - they are actually backed up by the FileSystem Shield and only allow for different (usually higher) settings / sensitivity for specific areas (those used by P2P/IM programs). So they are actually performance optimizations, and you certainly don't need to speculate about any footprint of theirs - because there is none if no such program is used.

And, regarding the general footprint - it certainly should be smaller for version 5/6 than it was in v4, both in CPU and memory usage. Especially the updates were rather heavy in v4.x.
« Last Edit: September 13, 2011, 01:06:53 AM by igor »

Offline avadas.de

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Re: BPP console scan schedules not followed by clients. Date/Time screwed?
« Reply #5 on: September 13, 2011, 03:55:59 PM »
Hi,

I also suspect some timezone problems (aside from the fact that the reports time format doesn't match the schedulers): http://forum.avast.com/index.php?topic=82941.msg687389#msg687389
Feel welcome to also visit the German Avast Community Forums for support and discussions with other security specialists as well as beginners!

Avast 19.6.2383 German Release Notes

Offline 1tb

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Re: BPP console scan schedules not followed by clients. Date/Time screwed?
« Reply #6 on: September 14, 2011, 02:28:43 AM »
Thanks for the info. Will have to do more testing before we can roll this out again in corporate sites. I presume one of the primary goals of the SBC console is to make deployment/management across pc's easy, but for us it has been quite embarrassing and it makes avast look unfinished and makes us look incompetent. Scans firing off willy-nilly, critical ports blocked on avast client firewall causing network connectivity failures to critical apps and no way to control/customise these parameters from the console.

All points to the SBC console product not being ready for release.  Roll on SBC SP2. It can't come soon enough IMHO.  :-\

Offline avadas.de

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Re: BPP console scan schedules not followed by clients. Date/Time screwed?
« Reply #7 on: September 14, 2011, 10:45:08 AM »
Hi,

the points you mention are not so much unfinished development but more or less concept. Ports need to be configured, if you notice any problems with them. Scans which are being repeated, when they missed the scan due to downtime, are on the wishlist for many system admins. E.g. what happens if the PC is never switched on at that time? Do you never want to scan it? I admit that many configuration options need to be still added to the console and there may be some bugs (like the point I mentioned), but please also note that this product has not been on the market for a very long time, like competitors solutions. It is a completely new product, which needs to be improved over the next months. And I am sure the devs are doing whatever they can to improve open points as well as fix bugs.
By the way...that's not only an issue with AVAST, but also with other companies, which release their newest development. Even with companies, which seem to be a lot bigger than AVAST Software. Just bring a bit patience. Watching the last two years development of 5.x and 6.x of the standalone product I believe that the same good development will also apply to the SBC.
« Last Edit: September 14, 2011, 10:48:21 AM by avast.de »
Feel welcome to also visit the German Avast Community Forums for support and discussions with other security specialists as well as beginners!

Avast 19.6.2383 German Release Notes

Paul Rodgers

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Re: BPP console scan schedules not followed by clients. Date/Time screwed?
« Reply #8 on: September 14, 2011, 03:27:31 PM »
What I ended up doing was using group policy to remove the shutdown from most of the users accounts. That way the scan does run. The bigger issue is if someone is on vacation or sick. I need to start their machine up before I leave at night.

Offline 1tb

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Re: BPP console scan schedules not followed by clients. Date/Time screwed?
« Reply #9 on: September 15, 2011, 01:21:36 AM »
Hi,

the points you mention are not so much unfinished development but more or less concept. Ports need to be configured, if you notice any problems with them. Scans which are being repeated, when they missed the scan due to downtime, are on the wishlist for many system admins. E.g. what happens if the PC is never switched on at that time? Do you never want to scan it? I admit that many configuration options need to be still added to the console and there may be some bugs (like the point I mentioned), but please also note that this product has not been on the market for a very long time, like competitors solutions. It is a completely new product, which needs to be improved over the next months. And I am sure the devs are doing whatever they can to improve open points as well as fix bugs.
By the way...that's not only an issue with AVAST, but also with other companies, which release their newest development. Even with companies, which seem to be a lot bigger than AVAST Software. Just bring a bit patience. Watching the last two years development of 5.x and 6.x of the standalone product I believe that the same good development will also apply to the SBC.
First, please don't take offence at my rely to your comment here. It is in no way intended as an assault on you in any way.

I agree about what happens regarding some rules/behaviour might not be what a company needs or expects and agree that these are not faults/bugs. What happens if a pc is never switched on is often tricky in a corporate world, so we have a policy that users are supposed to abide with- leaving pc switched on some days, etc.. This seems to work 99% of the time- particularly for windows updates.

I don't agree with most of your other points as follows:

1. in defence of the 'state of development' that exists with avast today (SP1 or at golden release). Sure it is a new product, and it has been in development for quite a long time and although a complete redesign of ADNM it has similar goals to ADNM so the team is not completely starting from scratch with goals and ideas. To use the 'new car' analogy, customers expect the next model to be better than the old model- not just 'different' - but better!

2. A paying customer wants to purchase a solution that is good value for money, works reasonably well and doesn't end up costing the company a lot of money in unnecessary admin tasks which are as a result of 'bad design' or 'unfinished design'.

I'm not referring to deployment or normal configuration tasks here, I'm talking about the fiddling around, figuring out why it is broken not working as advertised, then implementing fixes/workarounds because they are either features missing in the UI, or missing completely or just plain broken.

If we accept your argument about having patience waiting for fixes/service packs then who should pay for the 'patience' the customer or the reseller?

3. Arguing that other companies even big ones do the same thing, is not really a justification to a purchaser looking to buy a new improved and better model- unless they are taken in just by 'looks' alone.

Take the analogy of a 'new car' with similar 'caveats' in your defence. Should the customer just accept that the new model is 'buggy, missing basic controls, works well in most circumstances but does have a lot of problems' based on the proposition that it is a 'new design?"

I don't think so. What we have here is a 'concept car'. Great to look at but unable to be registered and legally driven on any public road until it meets a fundamental standard. The corporate world has similar minimum standards for software- particularly an AV solution. Avast is is essentially a 'safety feature' for a corporate network. We are not asking for 100% perfect- solution - nothing is, but how do you convince the buyer that they should buy 'THIS CAR'?


Offline avadas.de

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Re: BPP console scan schedules not followed by clients. Date/Time screwed?
« Reply #10 on: September 15, 2011, 10:34:10 AM »
Hi,

that is why most people take a test drive first, before they buy a new car or look out for second opinions. If the new car doesn't fit your needs, you won't buy it either. avast! also offers a 30 days test period. I am not saying, that bugs won't need to be fixed or that there is plenty of time to fix them, but in the first place you could have ruled out those basic needs of your network / concept, since to me they seem to be more or less discoverable in the test period.
« Last Edit: September 15, 2011, 10:42:01 AM by avast.de »
Feel welcome to also visit the German Avast Community Forums for support and discussions with other security specialists as well as beginners!

Avast 19.6.2383 German Release Notes

Offline 1tb

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Re: BPP console scan schedules not followed by clients. Date/Time screwed?
« Reply #11 on: September 16, 2011, 10:12:57 AM »
Yeah but its very simple to get in and out of a car- not so simple to get in and out of a corporate AV across many tens of pc's. Nor is it so trivial to test every scenario within the 30 days-  assuming the product may have been exhibiting all problems across all installed computers and assuming you spent all 30 days monitoring and testing. We actually didn't install across the entire business on day 1- since SP1 came out a few days later and we had all kinds of other issues with rollback problems!

In any case we just don't generally have the luxury of 'testing' in a sandbox environment on live servers. How would you propose testing the real product on a live server? - if you only install in on a VM snapshot or something you probably won't find out about the problems until you actually install it on a live server. (We didn't see any problems for over a week when we just installed on the servers- the problems started later on when when deployed to workstations) 

So I hear where you are coming from, but I think what you are suggesting is unreasonable in the corporate world, where we come to expect that products running on mission critical servers will be built and tested to a much higher standard than home consumer products. As for second opinions, there really were none as the product is too new- however if you look through this forum there are not a lot of positive reviews yet.

As a reseller I want to sell a product with confidence to a customer and I don't have 30 days of free consulting to check if the solution works in every particular environment across every single pc. Also some of the information critical to our deployment was not even available in the documentation or at release until some very helpful posters provided it on this forum- wpn take a bow!

The fact that SP1 was released so suddenly after golden suggests avast BP Console was just plain not ready for corporate release.
« Last Edit: September 16, 2011, 10:24:59 AM by 1tb »

Offline avadas.de

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Re: BPP console scan schedules not followed by clients. Date/Time screwed?
« Reply #12 on: September 16, 2011, 11:54:42 AM »
Hello,

I agree with you that the feedback here is not too positive, but you have to take two things into consideration:

a) The feedback in a support forum tends to not positive, because why should you have to sign up on a support forum, when you don't have problems?
b) The product is new, which means it is also very likely that bugs will come up in scenarios, which could't have been tested by the vendor beforehand.

I can only tell you from my person experience not related to supporting a software product, which comes from managing larger networks and working with all kinds of software from different vendors. You will always face the situation that a software company will release a new product to the market and having the marketing departments find the best words for it. In most cases it takes one or two service packs till the majority of the customers will have all their bugs fixed and wished fulfilled. That's my personal experience for completely new products, tough it is often the same for major version upgrades of alreay well-established software.
As a system administrator I always tried to gather different kinds of information beforehand, e.g. other customers satisfaction, time on the market, professional reviews and last but not least my own experience within the test period. The last point always came after some intensive investigation (the points I listed before), so I was sure that I could even install a trial version in a production environment or on a production server. You are right...you can't deploy every PC with it and roll back in the end, when you come to the conclusion, that this isn't your product. However you can at least fill 2-3 of the most common clients with it (maybe on Win7, one WinXP,...) and check if it works, maybe even ask for user feedback. Within 30 days you can gather a lot of own experience with it and then make a decision if you will buy that product or test another one.

Speaking from my experience as a supporter right for the avast! products...I admit that the initial release had a bad bug with the SQL installation, however we also had customers which ran a successful installation and saw their needs fulfilled.

Coming back to the original topic...I still see a lot of concept things in the "bugs" you mentioned above, therefore I would tend to say that those things could have been checked before. They are not "real" bugs.
Feel welcome to also visit the German Avast Community Forums for support and discussions with other security specialists as well as beginners!

Avast 19.6.2383 German Release Notes

avastuser74

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Re: BPP console scan schedules not followed by clients. Date/Time screwed?
« Reply #13 on: September 17, 2011, 07:00:56 PM »
Back to the thread:

This "time screw" seems to be in the forum, too. I post this answer at 6:57 PM (18:57-Germany) and the date in top of this window told me that is 04:57 PM.... very strange... or isn`t it? :-)

Hey, avastuser74, you have 0 messages, 0 are new.

September 17, 2011, 04:57:11 PM
 Total time logged in: 47 minutes.

wpn

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Re: BPP console scan schedules not followed by clients. Date/Time screwed?
« Reply #14 on: September 22, 2011, 06:30:07 PM »
@avastuser74:  i think its in the timezone settings from your forum profile

Quote
Hey, wpn, you have 12 messages, 0 are new.

22-09-2011, 18:28:43
Total time logged in: 6 days, 6 hours and 46 minutes.

at moment of copying it was that time