Author Topic: Some beta feedback. (Issues?)  (Read 2870 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline HeffeD

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 31
Some beta feedback. (Issues?)
« on: July 27, 2019, 07:34:36 PM »
I hope this is the proper forum for beta feedback/issues!

Omni takes too long to come back online after a network Disconnect.
I installed my Omni yesterday, and last night I updated my router's (Netgear R6400) firmware. I was surprised to find that after my router had rebooted, I had no internet connection on any of my devices. Having only had the Omni online for a few hours, my first thought was that the firmware update was bad. In the process of troubleshooting, I realized the Omni was offline. I waited a few minutes, which I definitely thought was long enough for a device to reconnect, the Omni was still offline.

Figuring it must have gotten very confused during the firmware update, I unplugged the Omni from power for 30 seconds, then plugged it back in. I waited again for what I thought was plenty of time for a device to reconnect, but Omni is still offline. I then reset it, and waited... I don't know how long it took, but it was easily more than 5 minutes. Just about the time that I was considering a reinstall, it finally came back online.

This was happening during a full AV scan on my PC. I did get the message that I had connected to a new network, (No, I hadn't...) and it wanted me to tell Omni which type of network I was connected to. I left the window open, and planned to address this when the scan had completed. Unfortunately, the message dialog times out. Shouldn't this wait for input from the user?

Is this expected behavior, or an issue with my unit? If this is expected behavior, I think it's important to try and lessen this time frame, because router reboots or firmware updates are fairly common occurrences. Less technical people aren't going to understand that they're still protected at this time, because technically none of their devices are actually connected to the internet until the Omni is back online.

Update: Yes, my unit breaks when I reboot the router.

I had been thinking about the issue, and when I initially installed the Omni, it was easiest to plug it into an open port on the switch in my entertainment center. I did notice that the Omni comes with a very short ethernet cable, so I was wondering if maybe having a 50 foot cat6 cable and a switch between it and the router was the issue. So I shuffled some things around this afternoon so the Omni would be plugged directly into the router.

Then I decided to time how long it took the Omni to come back online after a router reboot. I rebooted, and started timing after the router had fully come online. After twelve minutes, I got tired of waiting, because that is an absolutely ludicrous amount of time to wait for something to come online after a disconnect, and power cycled the Omni. I then waited another six minutes (!) for it to come back online. Six minutes seems pretty long for a disconnect as well, so I reset the Omni. It was back online in just a couple of minutes!

So something is definitely wrong here. The unit definitely shouldn't require a reset after a router reboot.

The software is also broken if you try to open it while the unit is offline like this. It requires you to force quit it. Even after a reset and the Omni is back online, the software won't recognize it as such, and you need to restart your computer to make it work again.

Network scan seems broken after initial install?
When configuring Omni for the first time, the network scan found all of my devices and said the device was protected. I did go through and name the devices it was unaware of. Now any subsequent scans only show my PC and my router. (Which is unnamed for some reason) It says there are no problems with the network, but the only scan that completes is my PC. The router just sits and scans indefinitely. Is this normal?

I wonder if I caused this problem by my power disconnection and resetting the Omni during troubleshooting of my network going dark. I did go through the reconfigure hub steps from the settings menu, but this kept all of the previous settings. Is there a method that can completely wipe the Omni and start fresh?

Edit: Reading the support documents, I found that you can factory reset the Omni by pressing the reset button for 10 seconds. I did that, but the network scan still behaves as mentioned above.

Omni doesn't respect connected device names?
Omni should report your network device names to your router. All of my devices were named on my router. During Omni configuration, if these names weren't added automatically, I renamed them so I can see these same names in my connected device list in Omni. Apparently one of my Amazon devices hadn't been online during my Omni configuration, so it wasn't recognized/named. It apparently woke up to phone home around 3:00am. When I woke up, Omni wanted me to list the owner of the device. Looking at the device details, the name was the internal name of the device, which was Amazon(list of characters). Since I have several Amazon devices, this name didn't meant anything to me. So I opened my router GUI to cross reference the IP address with the network name. It isn't at all helpful when you look at your LAN address table and see 17 devices all called Avast Omni... One of these days I'll go around and unplug all of my Amazon devices to figure out what this device actually is, but that's not happening right now.

Refresh the device list?
It would be nice if there was a button that will refresh the current status of your devices. I don't know how often Omni polls the device status, but it's a little confusing to look at the device list and see my VoIP phone listed as offline, when I can see that it is in fact online and I can make/receive calls.

More robust networking features...
Since this unit basically takes over your routers job of talking to your devices, in order for it to be taken seriously by users with larger or complicated networks, you'll need to add better networking controls. Such as DHCP address reservations, or QoS settings.

On my network, I definitely want devices such as VoIP phones to have bandwidth priority over basically everything, and I have several smart devices that require either a static IP address, or an address reservation in order to be properly controlled by my home automation software. So when I look at the list of devices attached to my router, I want to see my named devices (as I've already mentioned, above) as well as the actual IP addresses and QOS settings I've assigned them.

My home automation still works, so the Omni is interfacing adequately, but it really does my head in to look at my attached devices and just see a bunch of Avast Omni's with random IP addresses.  :o
« Last Edit: July 30, 2019, 06:04:20 PM by HeffeD »

Offline J.Spiers

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 34
Re: Some beta feedback. (Issues?)
« Reply #1 on: July 28, 2019, 12:57:58 AM »
I agree with and have seen pretty much all of these kinds of issues since getting everything up and running properly. Additionally, I'm also having an interesting issue with the Omni software where I remove a device that is no longer connected to the network being "re-discovered" almost immediately. In fact, I replaced my router the other day and the Omni software still "re-discovers" these devices even though they have never been connected to this router, WiFi or ethernet.

I haven't had an issue with the omni hub taking a long time to come back online after the router disconnects it though. For me, it generally reconnects right away once the router comes back online.

Jess

Offline HeffeD

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 31
Re: Some beta feedback. (Issues?)
« Reply #2 on: July 30, 2019, 06:47:16 PM »
I haven't had an issue with the omni hub taking a long time to come back online after the router disconnects it though. For me, it generally reconnects right away once the router comes back online.

Interesting. After a router reboot, or simply a network disconnect? They appear to be different.

Offline HeffeD

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 31
Re: Some beta feedback. (Issues?)
« Reply #3 on: July 30, 2019, 06:56:34 PM »
It appears that there are differences between a network disconnect versus a router reboot. I'm assuming that with a router reboot, it's likely that your network 'fingerprint' changes, which confuses the Omni. Meaning, that rebooting your router will likely issue new IP addresses to any devices that don't have a static or reserved IP address. (Including the Omni) I'm not a networking expert, so this is just a guess.

As for just a network disconnect, there are some obvious security issues. The unit will go offline and is unable to report its status to mobile devices. The software on your PC does appear to poll the Omni every so often, so eventually it will figure out the Omni is offline, but the app on your mobile device, (at least with the Android version) will continue to report that you're fully protected, even though the Omni is in fact offline.

Offline HeffeD

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 31
Re: Some beta feedback. (Issues?)
« Reply #4 on: August 01, 2019, 06:10:16 PM »
Omni causes my phone (Android 7.0) to disconnect from my network anywhere from 1 to 5 minutes.

My phone's network connection is used in part as a presence detection tool for my home automation system. The attached image shows my connection history from midnight until 10:00am. The 'network' line graph shows my connection to my router. All of the blue lines show disconnects.

The other line graph is monitoring my phone's GPS coordinates. I do use both of these to determine whether I'm home or not, for accuracy purposes. If all I was monitoring was my network connection, each disconnect from my router would be continually firing off the automations triggered by being away from home. (False positives)

This is quite abnormal behavior. When not using Omni, my phone only disconnects If I'm away from home.

Edit: After looking closer at my network traffic, other devices are being interrupted as well. None as often as my phone, but often enough for concern. Why is this happening?

Update: The disconnects are only from devices connected through WiFi. I did relocate the Omni, wondering if it was generating RF interference since it is right next to my router. The Omni is now 30 feet from my router, but this has made no difference to the disconnects. And no, I do not have any WiFi disconnects when not using the Omni.

I know that the concept of the Omni is network wide protection, including IOT devices, but if part of this protection is causing disconnects to WiFi reliant IOT devices, It's actually a hindrance for home automation setups.



« Last Edit: August 05, 2019, 12:05:27 AM by HeffeD »

Offline HeffeD

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 31
Re: Some beta feedback. (Issues?)
« Reply #5 on: August 05, 2019, 10:24:46 PM »
This is a partial log from my home automation system complaining about the connections being dropped.

Offline HeffeD

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 31
Re: Some beta feedback. (Issues?)
« Reply #6 on: August 15, 2019, 11:08:04 PM »
What is the actual purpose of this beta? Is it actually a stress test and you're really just wanting bodies to give you more networks to monitor, and you aren't actually looking for problems to be reported?

I'm just curious because I've never participated in a beta where there is so little feedback from the devs. This has been a very odd experience so far. I've reported some serious issues and haven't heard anything! Not even a, "we're looking into it"...

Currently, this product is unusable for me due to the way it's interrupting my network traffic and causing triggers to misfire with my home automation system. Is anybody else participating in the beta having this issue? Or am I the only one that has active device monitoring and is able to see it happening?

I'm willing to continue running the Omni in the interests of beta testing, but the lack of input from the devs has me wondering if it's worth the hassle to do so. I'm all for helping to improve the product, but if I'm putting up with a headache for something that is apparently beyond the scope of this testing phase, then I'd like to know and I'll remove it from my network.

Thanks!

Offline Filip Havlicek

  • Avast team
  • Massive Poster
  • *
  • Posts: 2653
Re: Some beta feedback. (Issues?)
« Reply #7 on: August 17, 2019, 01:30:55 PM »
Hi HeffeD,

first of all, sorry for nobody from the Avast team replying to your messages. I have a feeling that your issues being so specific might have played a part in it. The purpose of the beta is definitely to gather feedback and fix potential issues.

Sending logs from your Omni hub
Since at least some of the issues here might require you to send us logs from your hub after you reproduce the issue, here is how to do it. Both Android and iOS admin/parent apps should contain an option to send logs from your hub in "More - Help & Feedback - Send Bug Report". The implementation is unfortunately not optimal at the moment so once you get the "OK" message, it only started sending the logs, not finished it - the logs are usually 100-200MB in size, so adjust the time accordingly based on your upload speed. Whenever you reproduce anything and upload the logs, note an approximate time of the upload and let me know what was the issue so that I can assign the investigation to proper people in the team. Now to tackle at least some of the issues.

Omni takes too long to come back online after a network disconnect
It definitely shouldn't take the hub to come back online after either router flash/reboot or the hub reboot itself. Not sure how long your router itself takes to reboot, but for example at my home if I reboot the router everything is back online in under 60 seconds and out of those it takes at least 30 seconds for the router itself to reboot. Both R6400 and R6400v2 should be supported, so I'm thinking it shouldn't be a case of router-hub incompatibility, but rather something with the hub itself or the network setup you are running might be somehow interfering with the hub. The hub is meant to be plugged into the main router, switch should matter that much, but if it's a managed one, it can definitely have an influence. To narrow this down a bit, can you try reproducing this and sending us the logs? Please note the times you rebooted the hub/router and the hub coming online so we can relate the logs with what you are experiencing. I can't really comment about the state of the Windows client you also mentioned, things should have changed for the better since you first posted, if you are still having troubles with the Windows client, let me know.

Network scan seems broken after initial install
I'm not sure what "network scan" you mean. When you open the Omni Windows client, is it the "Your home - X Online devices" section or the "This computer - Protection - Wi-Fi Inspector" section?

Omni doesn't respect connected device names
You are mentioning two issues here. First one is Omni not picking up names of your devices as you set them up on the router. As far as I know (and you can totally prove me wrong here) renaming devices on your router is a router-proprietary feature and it doesn't reflect in actual network hostnames of the devices nor the route provides any API to read those. There isn't much we can do about that unless Netgear can be convinced to provide an API for this. Second issue is your router listing 17 devices called Avast Omni. That is an unfortunate sideeffect of how we acquire traffic (we basically need to convince the router the hub represents all the devices and vice versa) and there isn't much we can do about that. Maybe this is going to change in one of the future software/firmware releases, but I can't make any promises at the moment.

Refresh the device list
The "refresh" should happen in terms of minutes, might depend on the actual (type of) device, especially in the online->offline direction. Did it get better over time or does this still happen? If it still happens, can you reproduce and send us the logs? Apart from the time I'd also need the IP and MAC of the device in question.

More robust networking features
We don't touch DHCP in the current setup, so DHCP leases are still issues by your router and therefore any setup you have in place, such as DHCP reservation, should be preserved. Can you confirm your devices get different IP addresses than they should? About QoS, I don't believe we interfere with it in any way, so again whatever you have set up should be working - I would need to verify this is the case as I haven't personally seen a network with Omni hub and any kind of QoS yet.

Omni hub offline reporting
The status should be generally done via the communication of the Omni hub with our cloud. The thing with Android especially (and I suspect iOS as well) is that once the screen is off, the device is not really connected to the Internet all the time, but it connects from time to time (if you want to read about it more, search for Android Doze for example, specific vendors also tend to implement their own things). So it can really be that the hub is reported as offline in our cloud, but the information just didn't get into the Android device.

Omni causes my phone (Android 7.0) to disconnect from my network anywhere from 1 to 5 minutes
This is something I have never seen before, it shouldn't really disconnect anything for such a long time (I have seen ~15 second disconnects on my network in the past whenever there was supposed to be a DHCP re-lease, but that got fixed since then). Is it really for 1-5 minutes? Can you watch out for it and whenever it happens again (especially for the longer time periods above 1 minute), send us the logs with the approximate time the device was offline and its IP and MAC address?

Thanks for the feedback and for the wait as well, let's hope we can get this moving from now on :)

Filip
« Last Edit: August 22, 2019, 02:49:06 PM by Filip Havlicek »

Offline HeffeD

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 31
Re: Some beta feedback. (Issues?)
« Reply #8 on: August 17, 2019, 05:58:57 PM »
Thanks for the feedback and for the wait as well, let's hope we can get this moving from now on :)

Thank you Filip, for your detailed response. I really appreciate it!  :)

I'll reinstall and get some logs.

I haven't experimented with the router reboots since I initially reported them. As for the network setup, I'll have the Omni plugged directly into my router. I initially did have it running through a switch, but did reconnect a few things so it was plugged into the router. I do run a DNS server on my network. Is Omni also trying to act as a DNS server? Perhaps the two are fighting? I'll have to do some more tests.

Yes, with the Network Scan Issue, it's the Wi-Fi Inspector. When the scan 'completes', It has only secured the PC. The router just scans forever. I'm comparing it to the initial network scan when it locates all of the connected devices and secures them.

Thanks for letting me know about DHCP. I'll look the devices up by their MAC addresses and see if they're actually getting different IP addresses than they should. I'll also look into the QoS. The naming issue makes sense now that you mention it...

Thanks again, I'll get back to testing.
-HeffeD

Offline HeffeD

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 31
Re: Some beta feedback. (Issues?)
« Reply #9 on: August 17, 2019, 07:10:14 PM »
Here is a screenshot showing the Wi-Fi Inspector behavior. As you can see, the scan says it's complete and that there are no issues, but the router entry is still scanning. It never completes the scan.

Offline bob3160

  • Avast √úberevangelist
  • Probably Bot
  • *****
  • Posts: 41709
  • 59 Years of Happiness
    • bob3160 Protecting Yourself, Your Computer and, Your Identity
Re: Some beta feedback. (Issues?)
« Reply #10 on: August 17, 2019, 11:01:46 PM »
Granted, it takes a long time for the scan to complete but, on my systems,
it did finish the scan.
Free avast! Security Seminar: https://goo.gl/kh3cqR  -  Important: http://www.organdonor.gov/ -- My Web Site: http://bob3160.strikingly.com/ - Win 10 Pro v1903 64bit, 8 Gig Ram, AvastFree 19.6.xxxx, How to Successfully Install Avast http://goo.gl/VLXdeRepair & Clean Install https://goo.gl/t7aJGq

Offline HeffeD

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 31
Re: Some beta feedback. (Issues?)
« Reply #11 on: August 18, 2019, 12:37:39 AM »
What happens when you run the scan again? It will give me results like that the first time, but never again. I've waited several hours to see what happened, and the router stayed as shown in my screenshot.

Offline bob3160

  • Avast √úberevangelist
  • Probably Bot
  • *****
  • Posts: 41709
  • 59 Years of Happiness
    • bob3160 Protecting Yourself, Your Computer and, Your Identity
Re: Some beta feedback. (Issues?)
« Reply #12 on: August 18, 2019, 12:44:47 AM »
What happens when you run the scan again? It will give me results like that the first time, but never again. I've waited several hours to see what happened, and the router stayed as shown in my screenshot.
I just opened the UI and this is what I got on the next run of the scan. (It only took a second.)
Free avast! Security Seminar: https://goo.gl/kh3cqR  -  Important: http://www.organdonor.gov/ -- My Web Site: http://bob3160.strikingly.com/ - Win 10 Pro v1903 64bit, 8 Gig Ram, AvastFree 19.6.xxxx, How to Successfully Install Avast http://goo.gl/VLXdeRepair & Clean Install https://goo.gl/t7aJGq

Offline HeffeD

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 31
Re: Some beta feedback. (Issues?)
« Reply #13 on: August 18, 2019, 01:33:11 AM »
Odd... You don't show anything on your second scan. I wonder which is correct?

Offline HeffeD

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 31
Re: Some beta feedback. (Issues?)
« Reply #14 on: August 18, 2019, 01:43:54 AM »
Filip, I just uploaded a log file at around 5:30pm MST. (I believe around 1:30am forum time)

The logs show two router reboots. I don't know how long it took to come back online the first time, because I wasn't expecting it to come back online, so I ran an errand.

I did another reboot, and it took 19 minutes for the hub to come back online. And interestingly, when this happens, it logs me out of my Avast account, and I need to relog using the desktop software.

As I've stated, my router is a Netgear R6400 (V1) and I have the hub plugged directly into the router using the short Ethernet cable supplied with the hub.

Edit: My router reboots in about 60 seconds.

Thanks!
-HeffeD