Author Topic: The consequence of poor testing  (Read 15268 times)

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OisteinR

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Re: The consequence of poor testing
« Reply #45 on: February 27, 2012, 03:03:45 PM »
Avast Team????
Where the h... are they?
I've got 5 computers with Avast, and 4 of them acts ok, but the fifth - disaster.

There's no user error here, and as VLK stated in the first release post:
"Update from v6 should of course be also possible via the built-in program updater."

Everything went just fine until final release. I've been through all betas, without problems.


AVAST! where are you. Please tell us you are alive and well...

This is maybe the biggest disaster in Avast' history.

 :( :( :(

Paul Rodgers

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Re: The consequence of poor testing
« Reply #46 on: February 27, 2012, 03:52:29 PM »
There are three groups here.
1. people who install Avast, get the multiple issues, have "faith" in Avast and then come on the forum trying to work around the issues. Regardless the efforts needed, regardless what the issues can be. These are the "fanboys".
2. people who install Avast, get the multiple issues, don't understand what is happening and call somebody else for support, this of course leads to the removal of Avast and its substitution with something else, because who ever does the support doesn't want to deal with unnecessary (and undocumented) issues.
3. people who install Avast, get the multiple issues, think "nice, they haven't tested this crap before pushing it as auto-update", get mad and disappointed, remove Avast and look for something else not because other products are technically better but because Avast isn't trustworthy. Once you don't trust a firm that should provide "security", you don't come to the forum looking for help and/or to help with fixing bugs.

On a side note: there is a well known nonsense trend, "security" bloated suites that make more harm than good.
The old "now with feature XYZ!" or "smarter, faster, more powerful than before".
But as soon as you understand a little bit of Windows systems, you want the exact opposite, the less crappy software possible installed on your PC. And when the new "gold-super-ultra-pro" version of any software cripples your PC and you need to perform an emergency recover in safe mode, you think twice before reinstalling it. Take a look at Avast 7 GUI.

If you don't want to use avast and are just coming here to slam a product when there are many people that aren't having issues then I think you need to leave.

There are many users out there that aren't having problems and are therefore not coming to the forums. The negative reviews will always outweigh the positive on a support forum because not many people write reviews on good products.

By the way you forgot the group of people without problems with the new version, the group of people that had problems and fixed them and are now helping others, and the group of people that had no problems and are helping other with their problems.

n01clueless

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Re: The consequence of poor testing
« Reply #47 on: February 27, 2012, 04:28:33 PM »

By the way you forgot the group of people without problems with the new version, the group of people that had problems and fixed them and are now helping others, and the group of people that had no problems and are helping other with their problems.

You also have failed to mention the most significant group of all, and that is the hordes of Avast users who have experienced problems but do not have the requisite skills to sort them out themselves and who now have either a computer that isn't functioning properly or have had to dig into their pockets to get the problem(s) sorted.

Offline BTIsaac

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Re: The consequence of poor testing
« Reply #48 on: February 27, 2012, 06:29:27 PM »
I don't think he's a troll. He's a got a good point in the issues. His arguments are logical enough to be considered significant for avast's improvement.

What points? The only points he made were complaining about vague issues with v7, but refusing to specify them, insisting that the devs ignore any error reports from their users and treating it as a fact, and calling everyone who didn't immediately remove Avast from their computer and switch to another AV after v7 a "fanboy".

In fact he pretty much stated himself that his only intention with this thread was to tell us that Avast sucks, and we suck for using it. That's a textbook case of trolling right there.

Offline Lisandro

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Re: The consequence of poor testing
« Reply #49 on: February 28, 2012, 12:12:43 AM »
We're working very very hard to follow the most active forum... You users are keeping us, users as well, quite busy :)
The best things in life are free.

Dch48

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Re: The consequence of poor testing
« Reply #50 on: February 28, 2012, 12:33:05 AM »
There are three groups here.
1. people who install Avast, get the multiple issues, have "faith" in Avast and then come on the forum trying to work around the issues. Regardless the efforts needed, regardless what the issues can be. These are the "fanboys".
2. people who install Avast, get the multiple issues, don't understand what is happening and call somebody else for support, this of course leads to the removal of Avast and its substitution with something else, because who ever does the support doesn't want to deal with unnecessary (and undocumented) issues.
3. people who install Avast, get the multiple issues, think "nice, they haven't tested this crap before pushing it as auto-update", get mad and disappointed, remove Avast and look for something else not because other products are technically better but because Avast isn't trustworthy. Once you don't trust a firm that should provide "security", you don't come to the forum looking for help and/or to help with fixing bugs.
This is  completely wrong. There is a 4th and probably largest group. That is the people who upgraded to v7 and have had none of the problems. I upgraded all 3 of the machines here without a hitch and did every one through the updating feature in the GUI. Not only that but 2 of them have subsequently been upgraded to the full AIS suite also through the GUI without having to even download the installation file. There are a few small glitches such as the gadget breaking auto sandbox exclusions, Safe Zone browser not remembering settings, and issues downloading things with IE in the sandbox but none of these are gamebreakers. Just don't use the gadget for now and if running IE sandboxed, just let downloads go to the default downloads folder. 

I have experienced none of the other issues being reported by people. You are trying to make it seem that everybody has those problems and it's simply not the case at all.

Offline Lisandro

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Re: The consequence of poor testing
« Reply #51 on: February 28, 2012, 01:43:41 AM »
There are three groups here.
1. people who install Avast, get the multiple issues, have "faith" in Avast and then come on the forum trying to work around the issues. Regardless the efforts needed, regardless what the issues can be. These are the "fanboys".
2. people who install Avast, get the multiple issues, don't understand what is happening and call somebody else for support, this of course leads to the removal of Avast and its substitution with something else, because who ever does the support doesn't want to deal with unnecessary (and undocumented) issues.
3. people who install Avast, get the multiple issues, think "nice, they haven't tested this crap before pushing it as auto-update", get mad and disappointed, remove Avast and look for something else not because other products are technically better but because Avast isn't trustworthy. Once you don't trust a firm that should provide "security", you don't come to the forum looking for help and/or to help with fixing bugs.

On a side note: there is a well known nonsense trend, "security" bloated suites that make more harm than good.
The old "now with feature XYZ!" or "smarter, faster, more powerful than before".
But as soon as you understand a little bit of Windows systems, you want the exact opposite, the less crappy software possible installed on your PC. And when the new "gold-super-ultra-pro" version of any software cripples your PC and you need to perform an emergency recover in safe mode, you think twice before reinstalling it. Take a look at Avast 7 GUI.
Sorry to disagree. There are tons of people here that are not fanboys and are trying to help. Do not forget that we're in the good boys side and releasing a free application to 200 million users.
The best things in life are free.

Offline .: L' arc :.

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Re: The consequence of poor testing
« Reply #52 on: February 28, 2012, 07:47:56 AM »
@BTIsaac: Because a lot of us can actually sort out most problems in avast, we tend to consider his dilemma as something so trivial that we no longer listen to his side and instead, we forced him to change his opinion--which defeats the purpose of calling it an "opinion".
Windows 7 (64-bit) Home Premium SP1
avast! 9 RC1

LorenzoC

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Re: The consequence of poor testing
« Reply #53 on: February 28, 2012, 09:29:56 AM »
This thread started as a mix of rant and bug reporting. Yes, both useless because the issues are/were so obvious.

The only answer that would have made sense and that would have ended the thread as well should have been:
"Yes there are some serious issues in the newly released v.7. They are working on it, meaniwhile you are advised to not update from v. 6 either to update to v.7 by manually uninstalling v.6 and performing a clean install of v.7."

Instead they were:
"Did you uninstall v6 with the tool before upgrading to v7? That is a recommended way to upgrade instead of an in place upgrade."
(Nonsense #1 - I have written above I have installed v.7, it failed and I have removed it in Safe Mode. Like MANY other people.).

"I am not sure why people are so quick to give up, when most the time it is user error"
(Nonsense #2 - most of the time it is user error? Involuntary self-irony. )

"I think Avast does a marvelous job of testing!"
(Nonsense #3 - Yeah right)

And this goes on forever, here is another example:
"I have experienced none of the other issues being reported by people"
(Nonsense #n - Like it matters if 70% or 80% or 90% people don't get any problem or haven't seen it yet when there are still 30% or 20% or 10% with a crippled PC)

I have said above the reason why I find this unacceptable. The magnitude of the issues met this time clearly show that the testing was inadequate. We aren't speaking of a bug like the "Script Shield" that is not working with Firefox like on v.6, here Avast failed to install and failed to uninstall, requiring the Safe Mode removal (plus all the other issues I am not mentioning).  And when it comes to tools like Avast there is a point where you become not trustworthy any more. Once v.7 fails that bad, I am not going to install it again until it gets fixed. If ever.

Avast is not a toy for me and I am not involved with its development. I don't find any rewarding in working around issues or in following the progression as new features mature, bug are squashed, Avast becomes stable. It is just a tool that must do its job and stay out of my way. Which BTW leads to the said trend of adding questionable or useless features. If you ask me, I would trade all the "advanced - new features" and even a lower detection rate for a software that just works.
« Last Edit: February 28, 2012, 09:37:32 AM by LorenzoC »

Offline lukas.hasik

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Re: The consequence of poor testing
« Reply #54 on: February 28, 2012, 11:08:23 AM »
to close this thread :
1, avast does test the program before releasing and there are beta testers involved
2, avast 7 has some problems
3, the "program update" problem had nothing to do with program itself. It affected the distribution servers and then the corrupted distribution package screw up avast update mechanism during program update
4, updating program from previous one is preffered way. It's simplier for users and it should work. If it doesn't let us know as it is a BUG that HAS TO be fixed
5, I understand your frustration. I hope that we'll prove in near future that avast is really reliable product and these problems were caused by an unfortunate coincidence (it seems that they like to come in dozens)

thank you for all the reports
Quality is also a feature.

n01clueless

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Re: The consequence of poor testing
« Reply #55 on: February 28, 2012, 11:22:21 AM »
So, it takes 4 days for someone from Avast to admit there have been problems and to show some, albeit very limited, contrition, and still no actual apology for the inconvenience, and worse, that many users have encountered. Customer service would appear to be fairly low on their list of priorities.
« Last Edit: February 28, 2012, 11:24:23 AM by n01clueless »

Offline AntiVirusASeT

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Re: The consequence of poor testing
« Reply #56 on: February 28, 2012, 11:59:24 AM »
IF customer service is poor, Avast! would have left u out in the cold. have a look at the forums, they are answering/helping with diagnosis as much as they can...

mind u, do not count the weekends. everyone needs a break, period.

Offline Lisandro

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Re: The consequence of poor testing
« Reply #57 on: February 28, 2012, 12:35:53 PM »
Customer service would appear to be fairly low on their list of priorities.
Nobody thinks this way. We acknowledged the problem and solved is as soon as we can. We also tried to provide the most valuable help to all users in forums.
The best things in life are free.

aztony

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Re: The consequence of poor testing
« Reply #58 on: February 28, 2012, 06:13:46 PM »
Quote
1. people who install Avast, get the multiple issues, have "faith" in Avast and then come on the forum trying to work around the issues. Regardless the efforts needed, regardless what the issues can be. These are the "fanboys".

And then there people like me who've used other A/V programs from Mcafee to Norton to ZoneAlarm (all paid versions) and discovered that Avast! (given away for free) is as good or better hands down. If that makes me a 'fanboy' so be it.

Avast! does many things good, and have for many years. Since doing a clean install, and having reinstalled PrivateFirewall after its initial resentment of V7, both have settled back into their unobtrusive, vigilant sentinel roles as if nothing untoward had occurred. I will not let this anomaly detract from what has been a solid A/V product.
« Last Edit: February 29, 2012, 06:40:23 AM by aztony »